Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

brofkand

macrumors 65816
Jun 11, 2006
1,348
3,448
Seems like most people in this thread have jumped in with a predetermined narrative. As @CapitalIdea posted earlier, this story is a nothingburger.

Employees formed a union. Apple announced new benefit for non-union employees. Apple will begin negotiations with union employees soon. That's how it's supposed to work.

The article is furthering the narrative by using words like "denied"

They're not being denied anything - they just have to go through the union as they wished to do.

I miss the days of neutral journalism that just reported the news.
 

avz

macrumors 68000
Oct 7, 2018
1,786
1,866
Stalingrad, Russia
Obviously Apple is familiar with a concept "to divide and conquer" the workforce. I guess it is not against the rules to be a conceptual.
 

visualseed

macrumors 6502a
Dec 16, 2020
904
1,862
This is normal. There is also a good chance the benefit package is being stalled by the union or being negotiated becuse they feel it is not being good enough. This is how collective bargaining works. Just because the union does not accept these benefits does not mean Apple is forbidden from offering them to non-union employees. They could also be outside the bounds of what is covered by Apple's contract with the Union.

During the height of the pandemic I watched state agencies going through budget crunches have to offer furloughs and early retirement packages to employees to cut costs. Non-union works got the benefits of these offers right away and were able to take advantage of things like federal unemployment benefits that were offered durning the pandemic. The unions balked and drug out negations for months and by the time they finally acquiesced most of the benefits were no longer available and their furloughs were extended to offset the costs incurred during the delay.
 

PlayUltimate

macrumors 6502a
Jul 29, 2016
932
1,712
Boulder, CO
My understanding is that Apple is is offering this benefit after the union deal, thereby treating employees punitively because of their union status.
When should Apple change the benefits for non-union employees? Only union employees are subject to contract terms because that is the point of the union. Apple, despite the optics, can, in accordance with state law, unilaterally change the terms of non-union employees. There is a reason why contracts exist. Union employees are get the benefits and protections per the agreed upon union contract. Now, could Apple have offered these benefits to the union for acceptance and approval? Most likely. But they are under no obligation to do so.
 

Wildkraut

Suspended
Nov 8, 2015
3,583
7,673
Germany
Instead of placing all their workers value above unionization benefits, increase trust and back their statements that they care for their employees anyway and unionization does not worth at all, they show exactly the opposite and serve more reasons why an unionization totally worth.

There is surely a reason why unionization became a topic inside Apple, well treated employees would not even think about it.

Apple gives a 💩 about their employees, just like about their customers, they walk over dead bodies for success.
More will be unionized, you’ll see.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: jnofi and LD517

Thebrochure

macrumors 6502
Aug 9, 2021
443
521
I guess I'm an old-school capitalist, because I think you should be able to pay your employees whatever the heck you want to pay them. If they don't like the pay, they don't have to apply. And if they're already employed, they can find greener land on greener pastures. And if your wages are too poor, or over-the-top-bad, you will go out of business and the system will flush you out and naturally rid itself of your bad businesses decisions/labor practices.

Ah, the free market and personal accountability. What a concept.
 

macos9rules

macrumors 6502
Apr 2, 2012
391
911
The ironic thing is Apple probably wouldn't be offering those new funds and health care features if the employees in Maryland didn't unionized. I don't think this is a cool move from Apple.
 

HMFIC03

macrumors 6502
Jan 19, 2011
360
419
Tokyo
I love it when trillion dollar companies that charge $20 for a small cleaning cloth argue that paying their employees slightly more would put them in grave danger.
I sometimes wonder how much Apple loses or gains with each of it physical stores. To me, they look more high lease galleries then say a target or Best Buy, but with in-person help. At a certain point, smash and grabs, unions, and employee mistreatment settlements, are going to have them weigh if juice is worth the squeeze.
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
8,795
10,933
I guess I'm an old-school capitalist, because I think you should be able to pay your employees whatever the heck you want to pay them. If they don't like the pay, they don't have to apply. And if they're already employed, they can find greener land on greener pastures. And if your wages are too poor, or over-the-top-bad, you will go out of business and the system will flush you out and naturally rid itself of your bad businesses decisions/labor practices.

Ah, the free market and personal accountability. What a concept.
In what old school version of capitalism were employees prevented from negotiating their salary and benefits?
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
8,795
10,933
I sometimes wonder how much Apple loses or gains with each of it physical stores. To me, they look more high lease galleries than say a target or Best Buy, but with in-person help. At a certain point, smash and grabs, unions, and employee mistreatment settlements, are going to have them weigh if juice is worth the squeeze.
They used to have the highest revenue per sq ft of any store. There was a well publicized comparison to Tiffanys. I can’t imagine that they are close to being a liability. Plus their value in supporting online sales makes them even more valuable than there own revenue.
 

visualseed

macrumors 6502a
Dec 16, 2020
904
1,862
I sometimes wonder how much Apple loses or gains with each of it physical stores. To me, they look more high lease galleries then say a target or Best Buy, but with in-person help. At a certain point, smash and grabs, unions, and employee mistreatment settlements, are going to have them weigh if juice is worth the squeeze.
In many places Apple Stores are single-handedly keeping malls afloat. Apple averages about 26% margins on sales in their physical stores. Apple averages about 650K in annual sales per each store employee on an averaging about $9M a year in revenue per store. There is plenty of room for profit even with increasing labor and cost of goods sold.
 

PlayUltimate

macrumors 6502a
Jul 29, 2016
932
1,712
Boulder, CO
Per the Apple website, Apple "genius" employees start, in CO, at $17.36/hr. Drove by a McDonalds in Louisville CO that was advertising at $18/hr. Salaries are quickly changing in the retail/service space.
 

PlayUltimate

macrumors 6502a
Jul 29, 2016
932
1,712
Boulder, CO
I'm not a lawyer - and this really would need a lawyer - but I suspect it could be discrimination and also wage theft (benefits other than your wage are classified as part of your wage)

Both are highly illegal - here in Australia management can go to jail for ten years if convicted.
I'm not a lawyer - and this really would need a lawyer.

This scenario may be slightly different since different stores have different hiring situations: some stores are unionized and need to follow union rules. That is not true in non-union stores. Further each state has unique labor laws.
 

Haust

Cancelled
Sep 3, 2011
262
332
In my opinion, unions are bad for workers and customers. They say this, the company I work for is ripping me off and making my workspace unsafe; therefore, we must join together and pay middle managers to demand better benefits, or else!!! The threats usually work to a compromise until the next round, and the company insets the extra costs into the products they sale. I don’t care how much money Apple makes. When you get hired, you are not being paid a percentage of the profits, you are getting a wage or a salary for what you do and what you agreed to do for that amount of money. That’s how much you are worth. Unions should be banned, especially public service unions. Don’t even get me started on them. This is my opinion. Others may disagree.
 

kingtj1971

macrumors 6502a
Feb 11, 2021
500
582
Alton, IL
The ironic thing is Apple probably wouldn't be offering those new funds and health care features if the employees in Maryland didn't unionized. I don't think this is a cool move from Apple.
That's incredibly tough to prove.... even if it's so.

Maryland is a very high cost-of-living state that also has a better formally educated population than most. I'm sure the Apple employees were demanding as high of wages and benefits as they could get, just to maintain the type of lifestyle they think they deserve for that type of work. That's fine, but it's just a retail sales job at the end of the day. It's been a LONG time since I felt like anyone in an Apple retail store was a true "computer genius". They give their people pretty good training to have quality interactions with the public, but they're just following directions to plug in testing equipment that says, "Yep - send this out for repair." or "No... checks out good." when they troubleshoot.

Truthfully? It's better to relocate to a place with lower taxes and expenses, if you feel underpaid there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PlayUltimate
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.