Apple to reinvent computer gaming?

[star-affinity]

probably a mini with an A12X?

Sounds reasonable. With capable performance for all the relatively low demanding games in Apple Arcade – with some exceptions – some of which struggle on the A10 in the current Apple TV. I mean the game Monomals (for example) running at 30 FPS at a 1080p television isn't a very great experience.

I guess Apple will go their own path when it comes to gaming, letting games created for their mobile plattforms also run on the Mac. Seems they aren't trying to compete with the heavier games on consoles and Windows, at least not in the short term.

 

[gkarris]

Sounds reasonable. With capable performance for all the relatively low demanding games in Apple Arcade – with some exceptions – some of which struggle on the A10 in the current Apple TV. I mean the game Monomals (for example) running at 30 FPS at a 1080p television isn't a very great experience.

I guess Apple will go their own path when it comes to gaming, letting games created for their mobile plattforms also run on the Mac. Seems they aren't trying to compete with the heavier games on consoles and Windows, at least not in the short term.

They can't compete - they'll go on their own, like Nintendo did..

 

[jeanlain]

probably a mini with an A12X?

Another silly rumour. If that's supposed "gaming" Mac uses an intel CPU, then it has no future. And if it can't run Windows, then it's less a "gaming Mac" than any current Mac.
Either way, this rumour is idiotic.

EDIT: I thought it was a new rumour.
And an A12X is less powerful than most GPUs equipping Macs. It's not even more powerful than Intel's Tiger Lake GPUs.

 

[star-affinity]

Another silly rumour. If that's supposed "gaming" Mac uses an intel CPU, then it has no future. And if it can't run Windows, then it's less a "gaming Mac" than any current Mac.
Either way, this rumour is idiotic.

EDIT: I thought it was a new rumour.
And an A12X is less powerful than most GPUs equipping Macs. It's not even more powerful than Intel's Tiger Lake GPUs.

Still quite good for many of the games in Apple Arcade. Plus I think the released Mac with ARM will be A14 or something like that. And maybe couple it with a dedicated GPU of some sort? Anyway, like I mentioned Apple doesn't seem to be looking at competeing with heavier Windows and console games (in the near term at least).

 

[SocialKonstruct]

The ARM transition means no more Steam and probably no more WoW for Mac soon

 

[Plutonius]

The ARM transition means no more Steam and probably no more WoW for Mac soon

I think that the OS X version of WoW might be re-compiled for ARM.

People who run the Windows version of WoW under bootcamp are out of luck.

The OS X version of Steam will probably be re-compiled for ARM.

Rosetta 2 will probably support most OS X 64 bit games but I imagine that there will be many bugs and the performance might be poor.

People who normally run Windows Steam under bootcamp are also out of luck.

I'll probably end up switching to Windows.

 

[jeanlain]

Rosetta 2 will probably support most OS X 64 bit games but I imagine that there will be many bugs and the performance might be poor.

Shadow of the Tomb Raider was running surprisingly well in the keynote video, assuming it indeed ran on an A12Z SoC. This particular game is likely to be recompiled at some point, so one will be able to compare the performance hit of Rosetta 2 (combined with optimisations from Feral).

 

[gkarris]

Shadow of the Tomb Raider was running surprisingly well in the keynote video, assuming it indeed ran on an A12Z SoC. This particular game is likely to be recompiled at some point, so one will be able to compare the performance hit of Rosetta 2 (combined with optimisations from Feral).

It was running really well...

But we shall see. If the A14X's GPU supports ray-tracing, then it may start to compete with the new consoles this holidays...

 

[Huntn]

I think that the OS X version of WoW might be re-compiled for ARM.

People who run the Windows version of WoW under bootcamp are out of luck.

The OS X version of Steam will probably be re-compiled for ARM.

Rosetta 2 will probably support most OS X 64 bit games but I imagine that there will be many bugs and the performance might be poor.

People who normally run Windows Steam under bootcamp are also out of luck.

I'll probably end up switching to Windows.

Rosetta 2?
Is Bootcamp on the chopping block?
I’m out of touch with Apple Mac news. For when you switch to Windows for gaming, if I was you, keep your Mac for real computing, or buy a MacBook for other than gaming computing.

 

[Plutonius]

Rosetta 2?
Is Bootcamp on the chopping block?
I’m out of touch with Apple Mac news. For when you switch to Windows for gaming, if I was you, keep your Mac for real computing, or buy a MacBook for other than gaming computing.

Apple is switching their entire line of computers to use ARM (processor family in iOS devices) instead of Intel.

Once the switch occurs, there will be no more bootcamp.

 

[maflynn]

Is Bootcamp on the chopping block?

There will be no Bootcamp - at least for windows. Windows is X86, the new Macs will be ARM, different and incompatible platforms.

 

[Huntn]

Apple is switching their entire line of computers to use ARM (processor family in iOS devices) instead of Intel.

Once the switch occurs, there will be no more bootcamp.

There will be no Bootcamp - at least for windows. Windows is X86, the new Macs will be ARM, different and incompatible platforms.

As I bailed on Mac gaming and using Bootcamp for Windows gaming (for when I traveled for work) in 2016, it‘s not a big deal for me, but I imagine some Mac users who wanted Windows accessibility on their Mac may be upset. I might be remembering this incorrectly, but my impression is that switching to X86 and Bootcamp helped Mac gain market share.

 

[star-affinity]

As I bailed on Mac gaming and using Bootcamp for Windows gaming (for when I traveled for work) in 2016, it‘s not a big deal for me, but I imagine some Mac users who wanted Windows accessibility on their Mac may be upset. I might be remembering this incorrectly, but my impression is that switching to X86 and Bootcamp helped Mac gain market share.

My wish is to have it as I have it currently on my Mac Pro from 2010 – start into Windows 10 for gaming and MacOS for everything else. That sure seems to go away (at least short term) if I get a computer with Apple silicon in a year or two. But maybe it will eventually be possible? I mean we have this: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/arm/

 

[Huntn]

My wish is to have it as I have it currently on my Mac Pro from 2010 – start into Windows 10 for gaming and MacOS for everything else. That sure seems to go away (at least short term) if I get a computer with Apple silicon in a year or two. But maybe it will eventually be possible? I mean we have this: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/arm/

Interesting, but it would still be up to Apple to make Bootcamp Arm happen.

When I traveled for work, a MBP with a dedicated graphic card was my ideal solution for taking Mac/Windows on the road. In it’s wisdom, Apple decided to put dedicated GPUs on only their most expensive MBP and as I was retiring, I said FU and I still spent $2000 on my 2016 MBP which I use today, but not for gaming. The talk of Apple revolutionizing gaming with their hardware pricing strikes me as amusing.

 

[star-affinity]

Interesting, but it would still be up to Apple to make Bootcamp Arm happen.

When I traveled for work, a MBP with a dedicated graphic card was my ideal solution for taking Mac/Windows on the road. In it’s wisdom, Apple decided to put dedicated GPUs on only their most expensive MBP and as I was retiring, I said FU and I still spent $2000 on my 2016 MBP which I use today, but not for gaming. The talk of Apple revolutionizing gaming with their hardware pricing strikes me as amusing.

Yeah, I just mean it seems there are some focus from Microsoft on making Windows run on ARM. At the same time that of course doesn't mean all games for Windows that are x86 will run. The next generation of consoles being x86 too doesn't help either I guess. So, it seems Apple strategy when it comes to gaming on their Apple silicon Macs is to let iOS/iPadOS games run on them, which overall (currently) are games of a different caliber than those on Windows and consoles. If Apple will offer some graphics hardware that can compete with what AMD and NVIDIA has things might change down the road so that Apple devices are one of those platforms developers of so called AAA console and Windows games also release for. But I expect that to take quite some time if it will happen at all. Would also need Metal to keep up with the technologies offered in DirectX and the APIs from Sony for the Playstation.

Oh, well. I'll see what I do when I feel the need to get a new computer. The one I have still serves me well (Mac Pro 2010).

 

[star-affinity]

There seems to be some gaming focus from Apple's side for sure:

Another exciting highlight for game developers is keyboard and mouse support for gaming on iPadOS. Apple is letting developers finally add keyboard, mouse, and trackpad control options. While touch is obviously preferred for most iOS games, it opens the door for games like Civilization VI to add support for this in future updates.

And with future Macs powered by Apple Silicon able to run ‌iPhone‌ and ‌iPad‌ apps natively, we could see mobile games fully prepped for desktop peripheral use in macOS Big Sur.

iOS 14 Supports Xbox Elite Wireless Controller Series 2 and Adaptive Controller

 

[jeanlain]

On the software side, I think Apple does many things right with respect to gaming. They have very powerful APIs, and they support peripherals. But this alone won't entice developers, as very few Apple users have the necessary hardware to play non-casual games, namely a game controller and sufficient storage space.
Apple needs to release a device that comes with both, and which costs much less than a thousand bucks.

 

[sbarton]

AAA gaming is not in their corporate DNA. Most don't remember, but at the dawn of the color Mac era, there was a brief moment in time when Apple was the king of gaming compared to PC. It was short lived but ever since they have simply not cared...or occasionally it would get their attention only to be abandoned shortly after. It s a pitty really and a head scratcher to be honest, but certainly true. In many ways, gaming and entertainment drove the industry and the hardware, especially sound and graphics, to what it is today.

 

[gkarris]

AAA gaming is not in their corporate DNA. Most don't remember, but at the dawn of the color Mac era, there was a brief moment in time when Apple was the king of gaming compared to PC. It was short lived but ever since they have simply not cared...or occasionally it would get their attention only to be abandoned shortly after. It s a pitty really and a head scratcher to be honest, but certainly true. In many ways, gaming and entertainment drove the industry and the hardware, especially sound and graphics, to what it is today.

They may care now that many, many games will run directly on their ARM Computers (they did that Tomb Raider Demo and added more Xbox Controller compatibility).

 

[Huntn]

On the software side, I think Apple does many things right with respect to gaming. They have very powerful APIs, and they support peripherals. But this alone won't entice developers, as very few Apple users have the necessary hardware to play non-casual games, namely a game controller and sufficient storage space.
Apple needs to release a device that comes with both, and which costs much less than a thousand bucks.

The bottom line is that Apple’s business model is or has been based on high priced hardware which is not conducive to competitive gaming hardware. Now it’s been a while, but I when I buy a (now priced) $3k laptop that a $1k PC can run circles around at least for gaming, Apple has a problem touting anything about their games prowess.

 

[gkarris]

Did you see the benchmarks from the DTK? An essentially $500 A12X Mac Mini?

I feel all "tingly"...

VALVe/Steam - are you ready???

 

[Plutonius]

Did you see the benchmarks from the DTK? An essentially $500 A12X Mac Mini?

I feel all "tingly"...

VALVe/Steam - are you ready???

I don't feel tingly since most of the games I have purchased lately are Intel x86 that I play in bootcamp (i.e. no MacOS versions).

I'm sure Valve/Steam are already coding their app to run on ARM but people will still be limited to the much smaller library of Steam MacOS games.

The library of simple games in Apple Arcade should run very well but I myself have no interest in it.

 

[gkarris]

I don't feel tingly since most of the games I have purchased lately are Intel x86 that I play in bootcamp (i.e. no MacOS versions).

I'm sure Valve/Steam are already coding their app to run on ARM but people will still be limited to the much smaller library of Steam MacOS games.

The library of simple games in Apple Arcade should run very well but I myself have no interest in it.

Maybe some time next year...

This holiday year belongs to Microsoft and Sony...

 

[gkarris]

Has it started with the new M Mac Mini? $699, I guess we need comparisons withe the XBSX and PS5...

If anyone has info or experience with gaming on the new M Macs, please post here...

 

[maflynn]

I guess we need comparisons withe the XBSX and PS5.

I don't think we'll see any sort of comparisons between consoles and the ARM macs. Sure the new Macs can play candy crush or temple run, but not COD or Red Dead Redemption II and in all honesty I don't think we'll ever see those types of games.