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Mrkevinfinnerty

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Aug 13, 2022
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5,106
What, specifically, makes you think Apple would necessarily use anything other than USB2 data speeds on a USB Type C port?

They've done USB3 on Lightning before for an ipad, then continued to put USB2 on phones.

Thus my question - why do you think changing the connector necessitates changing the data speed?

Pathetic if they do.
 

solq

Suspended
Sep 9, 2022
410
615
China bans eSIM on mainland, yet other regions have eSIM-support.
USA already got their own variant of iPhones with 14, might as well keep Lightning
Not sure what you think that proves. It's much more difficult to change the main charging/data port than to enable or not a software feature. European phones have a physical SIM slot as well.
 
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fat jez

macrumors 68020
Jun 24, 2010
2,084
615
Glasgow, UK
What, specifically, makes you think Apple would necessarily use anything other than USB2 data speeds on a USB Type C port?

They've done USB3 on Lightning before for an ipad, then continued to put USB2 on phones.

Thus my question - why do you think changing the connector necessitates changing the data speed?
They’re using 10Gbps on the iPad Air 2022’s usb-c connection.
 

deeddawg

macrumors G5
Jun 14, 2010
12,245
6,393
US
They’re using 10Gbps on the iPad Air 2022’s usb-c connection.

Okay and?

Point is Apple has had the ability to put higher data rates on iphone, but they didn't.

I suggest they still may not feel the need to do so even if switching the connector type.

Or maybe they will.

Likely depends on their perception of whether there's more people who'd eschew such a low-wire-speed phone and buy something else than there are people who'd use the wired connection instead of using upgraded icloud storage to transfer their photos/videos/files.

I don't know which way they'll choose, just suggesting it's not a guarantee a USBC connector would be faster than USB2.

We shall see.
 
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sully54

macrumors 6502
Sep 15, 2012
371
959
Canada
And henceforth no competitor to the USB-IF will be allowed?
Not necessarily. A new connector/standard would require the backing of industry and companies to even just get off the ground. Its just like the HD DVD/Bluray battle. Companies took a side and eventually the market chose a winner.

If someone comes up with a new connector and specification that rivals USB, it would need support from relevant industries/companies and prove itself in the market. Put another way, for as long as companies place their support behind USB, then it’s very unlikely that a rival would come along.

For now, the USB specification (not just the connector) is so entrenched that this scenario is unlikely. What’s more likely to happen is maybe a new connector that the USB-IF comes up with that improves on USB-C. Although for now, USB-C serves its purpose well enough that even Intel’s Thunderbolt also uses the connector for their specification.
 
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emulator

macrumors 6502a
Britain isn’t part of the EU anymore.

The other plugs are pretty much compatible, except the ground pin.

But who carries a device with a grounded connector when traveling?

I recently traveled from Germany to the Czech Republic and my german travel plugs worked just fine.

This doesn’t mean that this isn’t an issue, just a smaller one.
Pure genius, you used a travel plug. With that logic, you can also use adapters all the time and every problem solved.
 
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brofkand

macrumors 65816
Jun 11, 2006
1,311
3,283
True. Tim Cook is so ignorant when it comes to products that I wouldn’t be surprised if an upcoming iPhone with USB-C was limited to USB 2.0 speeds. If that would boost Apple’s profit margins, Tim Crook would consider it.

I hope the iPhone Pro models in the USB-C era support 10Gbps USB - if not Thunderbolt (I mean, they make iPhones with 1TB of storage that shoot ProRes video). But yes I fully expect the cable in the box to be USB 2 speeds, just like the current iPad Pro models.
 

darngooddesign

macrumors P6
Jul 4, 2007
18,009
9,603
Atlanta, GA
I have no trouble shooting events on a Sony a9, transferring dozens of selects to my iPhone in my pocket as I shoot, doing some preliminary editing in Lightroom for iOS and AirDropping photos to my client's phone in seconds where they can then share them live with their audience.

The iPhone doesn't have an SD card reader and it doesn't need it, neither built in or plugged in. It has a well established App Store that can link to devices where those SD cards are inserted. If your camera doesn't already do wireless transfers, then it's your outdated tech that you need to update. The Future (present) is wireless.
My camera has wireless JPG but not Raw and I can have 200-500 shots at a dog show (mainly because you have to shoot a lot of bursts to capture them at their best stride).

Even if it did Raw, there is no way I'm using Wireless for that many 26 and 40MP files. I would prefer to use a Usb SD reader as I do now with a Lightning SD reader.

Now that the phones can shoot 48MP Raws, transferring those via wireless would be sloooooooowwwwww.

All that being said, if Apple just uses USB 2.0 speeds then its just them being petty which is entirely possible.
 
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senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Nov 2, 2017
2,534
5,264
I'm assuming you're looking at this through a technological progress lens?

I say we also need to consider looking through an ecological lens. With a lot of things wireless these days, that connector is less of an issue. I for one would prefer them to preserve the environment in this instance.
In ten years they may have move to an NFC that can transfer data securely and quickly and only use this old connection for power. I'm pretty happy with that compromise I think
Everything is a compromise after all.
This will force USB-A and micro-USB devices and cables to go obsolete as well. The amount of e-waste will be massive.
 
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ipedro

macrumors 603
Nov 30, 2004
6,238
8,507
Toronto, ON
My camera has wireless JPG but not Raw and I can have 200-500 shots at a dog show (mainly because you have to shoot a lot of bursts to capture them at their best stride).

Even if it did Raw, there is no way I'm using Wireless for that many 26 and 40MP files. I would prefer to use a Usb SD reader as I do now with a Lightning SD reader.

Now that the phones can shoot 48MP Raws, transferring those via wireless would be sloooooooowwwwww.

All that being said, if Apple just uses USB 2.0 speeds then its just them being petty which is entirely possible.

Where do you get that transferring wirelessly is slow? Do you not watch 4K movies over WiFi? Do you not download multi gigabyte files to your Mac via WiFi? Or do you have your Mac and iPhone tethered by Ethernet? We already use wireless transfers ubiquitously. Where do people get this idea that transfers from an iPhone is any different?

I just AirDropped 500 photos of a yoga class to a client in a park with nothing but my camera in one hand and my iPhone in the other to her iPhone. None of this required a single cable. She received them in under a minute.

WiFi 6’s theoretical limit is 10Gbps, the same speed as USB 3. What is it with everyone wanting to connect cables when we’ve long stopped relying on cables to get online and transfer massive amounts of data through the internet?
 
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mrochester

macrumors 601
Feb 8, 2009
4,552
2,466
Where do you get that transferring wirelessly is slow? Do you not watch 4K movies over WiFi? Do you not download multi gigabyte files to your Mac via WiFi? Or do you have your Mac and iPhone tethered by Ethernet? We already use wireless transfers ubiquitously. Where do people get this idea that transfers from an iPhone is any different?

I just AirDropped 500 photos of a yoga class to a client in a park with nothing but my camera in one hand and my iPhone in the other to her iPhone. None of this required a single cable. She received them in under a minute.

WiFi 6’s theoretical limit is 10Gbps, the same speed as USB 3. What is it with everyone wanting to connect cables when we’ve long stopped relying on cables to get online and transfer massive amounts of data through the internet?
Some people think their likely niche use case is something that everyone wants to do.

I suspect Apple sees the lightning port on the iPhone as solely for charging as they’d expect you to do everything else wirelessly.
 
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ipedro

macrumors 603
Nov 30, 2004
6,238
8,507
Toronto, ON
Some people think their likely niche use case is something that everyone wants to do.

I suspect Apple sees the lightning port on the iPhone as solely for charging as they’d expect you to do everything else wirelessly.
Honestly, ever since getting a couple of Qi charging pads and starting to notice them on office desks, coffee shops I work in or hotels I stay at, I’ve just stopped using the Lightning port for anything, including charging.

I haven’t physically tethered my iPhone to transfer data in… years? I work with a ton of data but I’ve embraced the Cloud to sync data between my devices. When I drop photos into Lightroom on my Mac, they just show up on my iPhone where I might swipe and sort through them while commuting and then finish the editing on my iPad with a Pencil. Not a single cable is used and I don’t explicitly transfer anything. They just sync seamlessly… wirelessly.

If Apple dropped the Lightning connector tomorrow and didn’t replace it with anything, I’d barely notice.
 

wanha

macrumors 65816
Oct 30, 2020
1,480
4,349
In the ten years since lighting was released, which would you say has had more innovation Lightning or USB-C?

Where to even begin with this comment:

1. USB-C is not European (you explicitly quoted the part where I said the EU is great at regulating and poor at innovating)

2. There are many reports that USB-C is originally an Apple invention that Apple gave to the standard body

3. Lightning is thinner and more elegant than USB-C

4. Is this the USB-C innovation you refer to?

5. If there isn't a very clear advantage to upgrading the charging port, companies are wise to leave them alone (remember the 1990s when most Nokia mobile phones used different chargers?). USB-C over Lightning is a minor step at best except for very few users that need lots of bandwidth in data transfer.
 
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Reason077

macrumors 68040
Aug 14, 2007
3,622
3,660
Not sure I’d agree. The port on my Nokia android got loose to the point it would no longer make a consistent connection. It had to be replaced.

However, the connection on the iPad Air 2022 seems very secure, so Apple seem to have a good design on their kit.

So, poor quality on the part of Nokia - not something that is fundamental to the design of USB-C.

If Nokia made phones with Lightning connectors they could well have had the same issue.
 
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Reason077

macrumors 68040
Aug 14, 2007
3,622
3,660
USB-C over Lightning is a minor step at best except for very few users that need lots of bandwidth in data transfer.

I think you're missing the point. Even if USB-C had no technical and design advantages over Lightning (which it does), there is still a huge benefit from standardisation. It's just so inconvenient and wasteful to have to buy and carry around different proprietary cables for different devices.
 

fat jez

macrumors 68020
Jun 24, 2010
2,084
615
Glasgow, UK
So, poor quality on the part of Nokia - not something that is fundamental to the design of USB-C.

If Nokia made phones with Lightning connectors they could well have had the same issue.
Yeah, I’d probably agree with how well made it was. The USB-C connector on the iPad Air seems much more secure.
 
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Reason077

macrumors 68040
Aug 14, 2007
3,622
3,660
The USB-C connector is great. But eventually it will be superseded by something else, whatever that may be. And unless they update this regulation the technology will lag behind.

Eventually, sure, anything's possible. Just like eventually the 3-pin wall socket might be superseded by something else, but it hasn't changed for the past 100 years or so. I suspect we're going to be on USB-C for a long, long time to come!
 
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mrochester

macrumors 601
Feb 8, 2009
4,552
2,466
I think you're missing the point. Even if USB-C had no technical and design advantages over Lightning (which it does), there is still a huge benefit from standardisation. It's just so inconvenient and wasteful to have to buy and carry around different proprietary cables for different devices.
As opposed to having to buy and carry around different USBC cables for all your devices?

I understand what you are saying in that (in theory) you will only need 1 cable and 1 charging brick to be able to charge everything, but just look at how many people lost their rag over Apple removing the charging brick from the box and now removing the charging cable for the Apple TV remote.

There seems to be a lot of people who want Apple to standardise on USBC but also don’t want Apple to remove charging bricks and cables from the box.
 

fat jez

macrumors 68020
Jun 24, 2010
2,084
615
Glasgow, UK
There seems to be a lot of people who want Apple to standardise on USBC but also don’t want Apple to remove charging bricks and cables from the box.
It seems like people complain about innovation being stifled but at the same time, don’t want Apple to change anything.

I hate to think how many chargers I have around the house from numerous iPhones and iPads bought over the years.
 
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wanha

macrumors 65816
Oct 30, 2020
1,480
4,349
I think you're missing the point. Even if USB-C had no technical and design advantages over Lightning (which it does), there is still a huge benefit from standardisation. It's just so inconvenient and wasteful to have to buy and carry around different proprietary cables for different devices.
Yes, but your point is tainted by idealism.

Hundreds of millions of people ALREADY have all these different cables. We're not starting from scratch today.

This mandate to USB-C means that hundreds of millions of lightning cables and accessories will be discarded and USB-C cables will need to be bought to replace them.

Now, if you had made your point to take place at the transition to a completely new standard, then I'd totally agree with you.

But doing it 10 YEARS into the product's life cycle is the definition of wasteful.
 

fat jez

macrumors 68020
Jun 24, 2010
2,084
615
Glasgow, UK
I don’t remember all the complaints when Apple moved to lightning from the 30-pin connector. Even though the same arguments about waste apply.
 
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