EU Proposes to Force Apple to Switch iPhone, iPad, and AirPods From Lightning to USB-C

[AndiG]

I don't know. I have two lightning cable in every room plus two in my car. Assuming I had usb-c, I would need two in every room plus two in my car. But I'm assuming as the need for lightning dies, they end up as e-waste and replaced with other cables...and those who are now buying devices with usb-c would have the same amount of cables as I would. How else could I charge an ipad and iphone simultaneously for example.

In my eyes this is a non issue. Just forgot to tell you that I even charge the batteries for electronic gear shifting on my road bike using USB-C.
In future there will be USB-C as a connector type and Apple with the only proprietary and USB 2.0 based connector.

Apple controls Lightning using its MFI program. And Apples MFI program is a part of Apples „lock users in, lock competition out“ strategy. There is no other reason.

The iPad Pro has it and other Apple devices could have it, too. If we get new regulations, Apple is the only one to blame.

 

[quarkysg]

Apple controls Lightning using its MFI program. And Apples MFI program is a part of Apples „lock users in, lock competition out“ strategy. There is no other reason.

I cannot connect the MFI certification process to lock-ins tho. It's just a type of connector with electronics in it. I see this as a consumer safety process where if the connector is not performing to specifications, it may cause harm, either to the device or the user.

Even USB IF has certification programme in place to ensure that its standards are met.

 

[AndiG]

I cannot connect the MFI certification process to lock-ins tho. It's just a type of connector with electronics in it. I see this as a consumer safety process where if the connector is not performing to specifications, it may cause harm, either to the device or the user.

Even USB IF has certification programme in place to ensure that its standards are met.

Customer of mine ordered lots of those cables from MFI certified partners. As far as I can see, all those manufacturers have to get certified by Apple.

But my MFI insights are not up to date …. It has been a pain in the … in the past and I‘m almost sure it is still today. As long as you aren‘t a big player in the industry, working with Apple is a cumbersome process.

 

[vipergts2207]

For me it’s the development costs, not the component costs, that drive adoption. Apple no doubt feels it has a reliable cost effective solution and thus no reason to spend money to change the plug.



I agree wireless is the next big move. By the time the EU directive becomes law it may be moot as cables are no longer used for charging or data.

And people are looking at this as an attack specifically in Apple. Let’s not lose sight of the fact that 50% of phones in the EU use the garbage micro USB connector. Even if the higher end phones go wireless, moving everything else to a single connector is still a good thing.

 

[I7guy]

And people are looking at this as an attack specifically in Apple. Let’s not lose sight of the fact that 50% of phones in the EU use the garbage micro USB connector.

It’s not an attack on Apple. While government can do what they want, certain decisions/regulations can have unintended consequences. Be can’t wait to see how this shakes out in a few years.

 

[polyphenol]

the garbage micro USB connector.

Much as I hate them, I am wondering what proportion of phones, available as new purchases, have them?

Even the bottom-end Redmi 9 has USB-C.

But I can see Nokia and some other bottom end devices with micro-USB.

Most of the micro-USB cables and devices I've used have not made it easy to see which way up the connector needs to go - especially in less than optimum light. Blame on both device and cable makers. As well as anyone choosing micro-USB since USB-C became readily available. So I look on it as an accessibility issue on top of everything else.

 

[jlc1978]

And people are looking at this as an attack specifically in Apple.

I don't think so. USB-C is fragmented and this is an attempt to fix that as well.

Let’s not lose sight of the fact that 50% of phones in the EU use the garbage micro USB connector.

With over half using the same connector already this directive seems a bit of overkill.

Even if the higher end phones go wireless, moving everything else to a single connector is still a good thing.

If the high end phones go wireless I suspect the remaining ones will be the ones using micro-USB so all it will accomplish is obsolete a bunch of chargers to be replaced by another set of cheap cables and chargers.

However, based on what the EU claims it will do I'm not sure it actually forces a common interoperable connector since it is focused on charging:

A harmonised charging port for electronic devices: USB-C will be the common port. This will allow consumers to charge their devices with the same USB-C charger, regardless of the device brand.

If companies move to wireless, there is no charging port and thus companies will be free to design their own solutions. Even the EU recognizes that:

With respect to charging by means other than wired charging, divergent solutions may be developed in the future, which may have negative impacts on interoperability, consumer convenience and the environment. Whilst it is premature to impose specific requirements on such solutions at this stage, the Commission should be able to take action towards harmonising them in the future, if fragmentation on the internal market is observed.

I suspect they will always be playing catchup.

In addition, nothing precludes a proprietary port that is not used for charging. A company could introduce its on high speed data port and be in full compliance. I doubt one will but it is possible; Apple could in theory stick with Lightening as a data only solution and wireless for charging.

A boon for companies is they will no longer include chargers in the box so they can cut out that cost and not bother to drop prices plus sell some chargers on the side; especially if they design a charger beyond the PD spec. If they do that they can force purchase of their charger for the fastest charging until others come out with a compatible charger.

 

[I7guy]

I don't think so. USB-C is fragmented and this is an attempt to fix that as well.



With over half using the same connector already this directive seems a bit of overkill.



If the high end phones go wireless I suspect the remaining ones will be the ones using micro-USB so all it will accomplish is obsolete a bunch of chargers to be replaced by another set of cheap cables and chargers.

However, based on what the EU claims it will do I'm not sure it actually forces a common interoperable connector since it is focused on charging:

A harmonised charging port for electronic devices: USB-C will be the common port. This will allow consumers to charge their devices with the same USB-C charger, regardless of the device brand.

If companies move to wireless, there is no charging port and thus companies will be free to design their own solutions. Even the EU recognizes that:

With respect to charging by means other than wired charging, divergent solutions may be developed in the future, which may have negative impacts on interoperability, consumer convenience and the environment. Whilst it is premature to impose specific requirements on such solutions at this stage, the Commission should be able to take action towards harmonising them in the future, if fragmentation on the internal market is observed.

I suspect they will always be playing catchup.

In addition, nothing precludes a proprietary port that is not used for charging. A company could introduce its on high speed data port and be in full compliance. I doubt one will but it is possible; Apple could in theory stick with Lightening as a data only solution and wireless for charging.

A boon for companies is they will no longer include chargers in the box so they can cut out that cost and not bother to drop prices plus sell some chargers on the side; especially if they design a charger beyond the PD spec. If they do that they can force purchase of their charger for the fastest charging until others come out with a compatible charger.

Is the mandate to force a charging port and it must be usb-c? Or is the mandate to say if there is a charging port it must be usc-c? Interesting unintended consequence.

 

[jlc1978]

Is the mandate to force a charging port and it must be usb-c? Or is the mandate to say if there is a charging port it must be usc-c? Interesting unintended consequence.

As I read it it is the latter, i.e. if there is a charging port it must be usc-c.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

In future there will be USB-C as a connector type and Apple with the only proprietary and USB 2.0 based connector.

This is a statement that has never been uttered previously about any connector, thus will very likely prove to be true.

not.

 

[I7guy]

Yup, nothing like having a brand new iPhone 13 Pro Max that can do 4K ProRes video that gobbles up 6 GB per minute. Oh, but lightning will transfer that video for you at blazing fast USB 2.0 speeds..

Or one could use 5g or wifi 6. Or decide if the use case is 4k prores and the iphone 13 won't support the persons' workflow to decide what other android might satisfy their requirements.

USB 2.0 was released in April 2000. VHS would continue to outsell DVDs for another 2 years after that. So yes, VHS-era.


The iPad mini is throttled in what sense? It can do data transfer at 5 Gbps USB 3.0 speeds which is 10x faster than USB 2.0 speeds. If that’s the kind of “throttling” Apple will offer, I’ll happily take it.

Article in MR News about the a15 bionic being throttled.

You’re the only one talking all or nothing. Nobody said said all lightning connectors fail. However there’s a notable issue with the fact that they are designed with no protection for the pins, which can result in premature failure. USB-C does not have this flaw.

No usb-c has other flaws such as easier to break off due to size and becoming loose when plugged in. And what is the percentage that actually have this issue. It's not and all or nothing proposition.

All you managed to point out is that USB-C can get lint inside of the port, which is a flaw with all ports. That’s not unique to USB-C. It also doesn’t render your cable garbage either.

As does the "lightning" flaws doesn't render your cable garbage either.

Exactly, so the whining about the EU missing out on innovation is useless.

Well no, it's quite probable this could happen.

 

[vipergts2207]

Or one could use 5g or wifi 6. Or decide if the use case is 4k prores and the iphone 13 won't support the persons' workflow to decide what other android might satisfy their requirements.

Ah yes, nothing like having move to Android because Apple can't support their own features properly.

Article in MR News about the a15 bionic being throttled.

What does a throttled A15 in the mini have to do with the price of tea in China? It still supports USB-C at 5 Gbps. You're grasping at straws on that one.

No usb-c has other flaws such as easier to break off due to size and becoming loose when plugged in. And what is the percentage that actually have this issue. It's not and all or nothing proposition.

Where's the data on USB-C failures? That's what you asked for when others pointed out well-documented lightning connector failures. The only thing I've seen you post is the ability of ports to collect lint.

As does the "lightning" flaws doesn't render your cable garbage either.

Yes it does. Once one side of the connector goes out, you no longer have a reversible plug as it will only work in one direction. Once the second side goes out, it's trash.

Well no, it's quite probable this could happen.

Probable or possible? Probable no. Possible yes.

 

[I7guy]

Ah yes, nothing like having move to Android because Apple can't support their own features properly.

That's correct. If a feature doesn't work to your satisfaction, either live with it, work with it or find a product that does. Really simple concept.

What does a throttled A15 in the mini have to do with the price of tea in China? It still supports USB-C at 5 Gbps. You're grasping at straws on that one.

Please go back and reread for context.

Where's the data on USB-C failures? That's what you asked for when others pointed out well-documented lightning connector failures. The only thing I've seen you post is the ability of ports to collect lint.

Wheres' real data on lightning failures? Only anecdotal evidence.

Yes it does. Once one side of the connector goes out, you no longer have a reversible plug as it will only work in one direction. Once the second side goes out, it's trash.

And if you break the usb-c plug it's just as bad...so pick your poison.

Probable or possible? Probable no. Possible yes.

Well there is non-zero probability the EU will shoot itself in the foot. Probable yes. Possible yes.

 

[vipergts2207]

Please go back and reread for context.

I did. You said:

Can you tell me the protocol of a potential usb-c port on an iphone 14. Apple throttled the ipad mini, is it a stretch to believe Apple won't throttle usb-c speeds on an iphone, should these come to pass?

So I'll repeat what I did last time. What does a throttled A15 in the mini have to do with the price of tea in China? It still supports USB-C at 5 Gbps. You're grasping at straws on that one.

Wheres' real data on lightning failures? Only anecdotal evidence.

I was asking you for data. Don't be hypocritical, hold yourself to the same standard you hold others.

Also, calling something anecdotal doesn't make it untrue, as you seem to think.

And if you break the usb-c plug it's just as bad...so pick your poison.

Is this a known issue with USB-C? Is this something that cannot happen to lightning?

Well there is non-zero probability the EU will shoot itself in the foot. Probable yes. Possible yes.

The only way it's probable is if innovation is more likely to come through wired paradigms, rather than wireless.

 

[I7guy]

I did. You said:

So I'll repeat what I did last time. What does a throttled A15 in the mini have to do with the price of tea in China? It still supports USB-C at 5 Gbps. You're grasping at straws on that one.

Since you're having a difficult time with this...If Apple can throttle a cpu, what makes one think they can't throttle a data port connection. In fact, we know practically nothing about the iphone 14...it may not even have a charging port.

I was asking you for data. Don't be hypocritical, hold yourself to the same standard you hold others.

Why I should I provide data because you asked for it. If you claim USB-C is reliable then you should dig up the data to prove it.

Also, calling something anecdotal doesn't make it untrue, as you seem to think.

Because something isn't untrue doesn't make it black and white. Because a lightning cable had a failure doesn't make them unreliable.

Is this a known issue with USB-C? Is this something that cannot happen to lightning?

That's the point, nothing design is perfect and people will have different sets of circumstances with each connector.

The only way it's probable is if innovation is more likely to come through wired paradigms, rather than wireless.

We won't know this for years to come.

 

[vipergts2207]

Since you're having a difficult time with this...If Apple can throttle a cpu, what makes one think they can't throttle a data port connection. In fact, we know practically nothing about the iphone 14...it may not even have a charging port.

It appears you don't understand the phrase "what does blank have to do with the price of tea in China." The two are completely unrelated. Because Apple throttled the A15 processor in the iPad mini, they're going to throttle the USB-C port in a future iPhone?? You don't see how incredibly asinine that sounds? Complete and utter non-sequitur lmao.

Why I should I provide data because you asked for it. If you claim USB-C is reliable then you should dig up the data to prove it.

You asked me for lightning data and expected me to provide it. Stop being hypocritical. The lack of notable failures versus what's out there for lightning speaks volumes. This is aside from the fact the Apple themselves have moved all but their lowest-end iPad to USB-C. Are you saying Apple has moved their tablets to an inferior and unreliable port? Their Macs too I guess.

Because something isn't untrue doesn't make it black and white. Because a lightning cable had a failure doesn't make them unreliable.

That's the point, nothing design is perfect and people will have different sets of circumstances with each connector.

It's not a failure.

https://***************.com/?q=lightning+cable+4th+pin

Your ignorance of an issue, doesn't make the issue disappear. It's possible for lightning cables to be generally reliable, while also having a notable flaw that can rear its ugly head. A unique flaw that is not shared by USB-C.

We won't know this for years to come.

We're not talking about knowing with certainty. We're talking about probabilities.

 

[jlc1978]

I was asking you for data. Don't be hypocritical, hold yourself to the same standard you hold others.

Here's an interesting article on US-C and some problems. No design is perfect. Anecdotally, I had a USB C connector fail rendering a $70 hub useless (and 1 year and a few days out of warranty, thanks Kingston). Does that mean USB-C is bad? No, just as with any connector tehre are tradeoffs and weak points.

Some key points for the TL;DR crowd:

The pin pitch of USB‑C connectors is 0.5 mm ― much tighter than the 2.5-mm pin pitch in USB Type-A connectors. This tighter pitch significantly increases the risk of a fault that could cause a thermal event. When connector pins become deformed or dust, metal particles, hair, or other debris gets stuck in a USB‑C cable connector, a resistive fault can be created from the power line to ground. These resistive faults can cause a dangerous temperature rise while increasing current only minimally. Damage to both cables and devices, even fire, has been reported (Fig. 1 ).

One interesting thing in the article is the discussion of designing cables to withstand 60 or 100W PD and deliver the advantages of faster charging:

As important as these advantages are to users, it’s equally important for designers to consider the safety issues associated with power and temperature management at the cable-to-device connection. Without proper circuit design, including temperature monitoring, cables and connectors can accumulate contaminants inside the connection, causing them to heat up quickly, which can easily damage or destroy the cable and the mobile device.

It talks about the how to adress temperature protection to protect the cable from over temperature failure. They involve insererting special devices in teh cable, which of course cost money. One danger is cheap cables may forgo these protections and as a result may experience thermal failure. The selling point is one cable to rule them all but unless every cable is made to teh highest specification end users may experience failures and wonder why, since "it was a USB-C cable..."

Is this a reason not to go to USB-C, no, nor does it mean Lightening is a worse choice, just different and situation specific. It highlights the challenges in educationg consumers and properly marketting cables. I doubt the Chinese factories churning out cheap cables will bother to ensure tehy meet thermal protection requirements for the capacity they can carry.

The Eu will need to mandate testing and labeling if they want to protect the consumer.

 

[vipergts2207]

Here's an interesting article on US-C and some problems. No design is perfect. Anecdotally, I had a USB C connector fail rendering a $70 hub useless (and 1 year and a few days out of warranty, thanks Kingston). Does that mean USB-C is bad? No, just as with any connector tehre are tradeoffs and weak points.

Some key points for the TL;DR crowd:

The pin pitch of USB‑C connectors is 0.5 mm ― much tighter than the 2.5-mm pin pitch in USB Type-A connectors. This tighter pitch significantly increases the risk of a fault that could cause a thermal event. When connector pins become deformed or dust, metal particles, hair, or other debris gets stuck in a USB‑C cable connector, a resistive fault can be created from the power line to ground. These resistive faults can cause a dangerous temperature rise while increasing current only minimally. Damage to both cables and devices, even fire, has been reported (Fig. 1 ).

One interesting thing in the article is the discussion of designing cables to withstand 60 or 100W PD and deliver the advantages of faster charging:

As important as these advantages are to users, it’s equally important for designers to consider the safety issues associated with power and temperature management at the cable-to-device connection. Without proper circuit design, including temperature monitoring, cables and connectors can accumulate contaminants inside the connection, causing them to heat up quickly, which can easily damage or destroy the cable and the mobile device.

It talks about the how to adress temperature protection to protect the cable from over temperature failure. They involve insererting special devices in teh cable, which of course cost money. One danger is cheap cables may forgo these protections and as a result may experience thermal failure. The selling point is one cable to rule them all but unless every cable is made to teh highest specification end users may experience failures and wonder why, since "it was a USB-C cable..."

Is this a reason not to go to USB-C, no, nor does it mean Lightening is a worse choice, just different and situation specific. It highlights the challenges in educationg consumers and properly marketting cables. I doubt the Chinese factories churning out cheap cables will bother to ensure tehy meet thermal protection requirements for the capacity they can carry.

The Eu will need to mandate testing and labeling if they want to protect the consumer.

I was not familiar with pin pitch, but looked into, so thank you for allowing me to learn about something new. The lightning connector appears to have a pin pitch of 0.6 mm, so quite literally a hair wider than that of USB-C. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that the biggest reason lightning would be less likely to have the concerns referenced above comes down to the power capability, or really lack thereof. The iPhone 13 Pro can charge at a maximum rate of 27 watts. To my knowledge this is higher than than any other lighting device from Apple. So lightning's saving grace, if you'd like to call it that, is that it's simply not being asked to do things like charge devices at 100 watts where the risks above lie. If it were, it would have basically the same potential as USB-C to experience the issues referenced above. Especially considering that one end of such lightning cables are themselves USB-C. It would also seem that one way to mitigate these risks would to be limit charging to the ~30W that lightning is capable of. Correct me if I've misunderstood anything.

Edit:

Wow, stunningly serendipitous.

iPhone 13 Pro Max Capable of Faster Charging at Up to 27W Speeds

Despite not being advertised by Apple, the iPhone 13 Pro Max is capable of faster charging at up to 27W speeds when connected to a 30W or higher USB-C power adapter, according to testing conducted by ChargerLAB. For comparison, the iPhone 12 Pro Max is capable of charging at up to around 21W to...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[I7guy]

It appears you don't understand the phrase "what does blank have to do with the price of tea in China." The two are completely unrelated. Because Apple throttled the A15 processor in the iPad mini, they're going to throttle the USB-C port in a future iPhone?? You don't see how incredibly asinine that sounds? Complete and utter non-sequitur lmao.

Apple can do what it wants. The point, as you missed it, is that they throttled a processor. Should there be a usb-c data connector on a future iphone Apple can establish any data protocol it wants, just has to charge the phone. And there is no mandate to the wattage of the charging protocols.

You asked me for lightning data and expected me to provide it. Stop being hypocritical. The lack of notable failures versus what's out there for lightning speaks volumes. This is aside from the fact the Apple themselves have moved all but their lowest-end iPad to USB-C. Are you saying Apple has moved their tablets to an inferior and unreliable port? Their Macs too I guess.

If you are making allegations regarding the lightning connector, by all means back up your unfounded assertions.

It's not a failure.

https://***************.com/?q=lightning+cable+4th+pin

Your ignorance of an issue, doesn't make the issue disappear. It's possible for lightning cables to be generally reliable, while also having a notable flaw that can rear its ugly head. A unique flaw that is not shared by USB-C.

All connectors have their issues:

It's 2023 and USB-C is even more of a mess

USB-C phones and devices are billed as the one-stop solution for all our future cable needs, but feature compatibility is a major problem.

www.androidauthority.com

3 Problems With USB-C You Need To Know About

The future isn't always painless.

www.howtogeek.com

We're not talking about knowing with certainty. We're talking about probabilities.

And no one can predict with any certainty any future event related to this topic.

 

[I7guy]

[...]

The Eu will need to mandate testing and labeling if they want to protect the consumer.

Interesting information. However, this is going to be a challenge. Same challenge today with lightning and use of unapproved (read: MFI) cables.

 

[vipergts2207]

It appears you don't understand that Apple can do what it wants. The point, as you missed it, is that they throttled a processor. Should there be a usb-c data connector on a future iphone Apple can establish any data protocol it wants, just has to charge the phone.

You're right, Apple has made some extremely stupid decisions before and it's possible limiting USB-C to USB 2.0 speeds could be yet another. I guess it's too bad we can't have more faith in Apple's competence.

If you are making allegations regarding the lightning connector, by all means back up your unfounded assertions.

I have. You choose to either ignore sources or ask for data that you yourself have not provided on USB-C. This "data" doesn't exist for either connector because nobody is collecting it. You simply use this as a cop-out.

You seemingly don't understand all connectors have their issues:

It's 2023 and USB-C is even more of a mess

USB-C phones and devices are billed as the one-stop solution for all our future cable needs, but feature compatibility is a major problem.

www.androidauthority.com

3 Problems With USB-C You Need To Know About

The future isn't always painless.

www.howtogeek.com

I do understand that actually. I also understand that USB-C generally has fewer, less significant ones.

And no one can predict with any certainty any future event related to this topic.

Duh? Again, we're talking probabilities based on Apple's actions thus far.

 

[I7guy]

You're right, Apple has made some extremely stupid decisions before and it's possible limiting USB-C to USB 2.0 speeds could be yet another. I guess it's too bad we can't have more faith in Apple's competence.

Yup. Apple can make any decision they want and we as consumers decide if buying their devices are in our best interest.

I have. You choose to either ignore sources or ask for data that you yourself have not provided on USB-C. This "data" doesn't exist for either connector because nobody is collecting it. You simply use this as a cop out.

But I'm not deflecting on the topic. All connectors have their issues, but trying to determine the percentage with any certainty doesn't seem possibility.

I do understand that actually. I also understand that USB-C generally has fewer, less significant ones.

If frying your device is a less, significant issue...then ok.

Duh? Again, we're talking probabilities.

Duh....we sure are. But we don't know the probability of any event as it could be infinitesimal to highly probable.

 

[vipergts2207]

Yup. Apple can make any decision they want and we as consumers decide if buying their devices are in our best interest.

Well, any decision they want within the confines of the law. Looking forward to the EU passing this one. ?

But I'm not deflecting on the topic. All connectors have their issues, but trying to determine the percentage with any certainty doesn't seem possibility.

I'm stunned that you've finally come to this realization, after incessantly asking for "the data."

If frying your device is a less, significant issue...then ok.

That's a risk for devices charging at very high rates. One reason this isn't a concern with lightning is simply because the capability is not there. The fastest charging lightning device only charges at 27W, versus 100W for some USB-C devices, where this would be a concern. You can very easily cap iPhone USB-C charging rates at 30W to mitigate such an issue. As an example, the Samsung Galaxy S21 tops out at 25W.

Duh....we sure are. But we don't know the probability of any event as it could be infinitesimal to highly probable.

Correct we do not know the exact probability. Don't know why anyone would think otherwise. However, we can use our brains, look at the evidence that's available, and come to a conclusion on which end of the spectrum those probabilities lie. In this case, Apple has signaled that future innovation will likely come through wireless paradigms. What are these signals? Magsafe, AirPlay, Handoff, AirDrop, SharePlay, AirPods, iCloud, wireless CarPlay, Home Keys, Car Keys, Apple Pay, AirTags, and I'm sure several other items I've missed. But sure, you do you and continue on with the "Oh me oh my, how could we ever possibly determine which direction things are going in and where it's likely innovations will continue??? It's all just so confusing and indiscernible!!"

 

[I7guy]

Well, any decision they want within the confines of the law. Looking forward to the EU passing this one. ?


I'm stunned that you've finally come to this realization, after incessantly asking for "the data."


That's a risk for devices charging at very high rates. One reason this isn't a concern with lightning is simply because the capability is not there. The fastest charging lightning device only charges at 27W, versus 100W for some USB-C devices, where this would be a concern. You can very easily cap iPhone USB-C charging rates at 30W to mitigate such an issue. As an example, the Samsung Galaxy S21 tops out at 25W.


Correct we do not know the exact probability. Don't know why anyone would think otherwise. However, we can use our brains, look at the evidence that's available, and come to a conclusion on which end of the spectrum those probabilities lie. In this case, Apple has signaled that future innovation will likely come through wireless paradigms. What are these signals? Magsafe, AirPlay, Handoff, AirDrop, SharePlay, AirPods, iCloud, wireless CarPlay, Home Keys, Car Keys, Apple Pay, AirTags, and I'm sure several other items I've missed. But sure, you do you and continue on with the "Oh me oh my, how could we ever possibly determine which direction things are going in and where it's likely innovations will continue??? It's all just so confusing and indiscernible!!"

Well I do thank you for the witty repartee. It seems in conclusion we might a scoche closer to our viewpoints than farther away.

Apple clearly won’t release the same model iPhone with different localized hardware. We don’t know if the plans for the iPhone 14 are baked yet and what the plan is.

You can be sure the world will be watching this (as well as South Korea)

 

[saber32au]

Let's throw a hypothetical situation into the mix:

Lets assume Apple produces both a lightning and USB C equipped iPhone, and assume they both phones function identically, and the cost difference between the two devices is small (ie the USB C equipped iPhone is either equal to in price, or less than $50/£50/€50 etc etc more expensive compared to the lightning equipped iPhone).

Which would you choose?

For me: USB C without question (whether I bought the phone brand new or second hand). Using one cable to charge my phone, headphones, earbuds, tablet and laptop would be brilliant! Most of my current devices are USB C equipped; adding a USB C equipped iPhone would remove my need to carry the lightning cable.