Lenovo X1 Extreme

[c0ppo]

Since Windows 8, Microsoft is maintaining 2 Settings portals. They just don't seem to care enough OR stuff is f'ed up, that they are busy putting out fires everyday in the Windows code base.

That bold part is true. Windows still uses that silly registry system. You can actually turn off a lot of bloatware if you know your way around regedit. They would probably love to drop that, but they can't. Because of backwards compatibility. And that 'backwards compatibility' is what is holding them back for a long time now.

Just look at windows updates. Sometimes updating takes more then an entire night! (happened to me).

Now, either that type of updates is normal, or something is very, very wrong...
I'm using Lenovo Thinkpad P series. Great hardware, no issues with hardware at all. Best keyboard on any mobile device without any competition coming near that keyboard! But only thing that I really hate on that laptop is Windows.

So my next laptop has to be Linux based, with dual booting for windows (.NET development).
For all my other needs I will use mac, like some light photo editing, sketch + affinity suite.

Mac OS would be perfect. If apple licensed it to other companies. Or at least to Lenovo

 

[KarmaRocket]

Same here. Every time I'm sure I'll go 100% Windows something draws me back to OSX. Love the customization on Linux, but for me app support will always be its Achilles heal. Just doesn't offer the same software as on OSX (or Windows), and the equivalent is usually inferior.

Windows is getting better with each release. They actually did fix the 2 settings panels since the last major update. They still have a lot more things to fix, but it seems they still have a ways to go. It's getting there though.

 

[SDColorado]

My money is on this

Never say never I suppose, but I just returned another sample of this batch of MBP’s and can’t see myself going back until there is a major revision.

Whether is is the X1 Extreme or another Windows machine that ends up on my desk long term remains to be seen. It depends on how the 30 days goes with this one I guess, but I don’t see myself going back and rolling the dice in the near future.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

This is so timely. My classmate's MBP 2016 died today. He is one of those hardcore Apple fans who never buys AppleCare because Apple builds reliable machines and he never needed one before. The Store told him it was a 'rare' SSD failure and it will cost nearly 700 USD incl. taxes to fix! For a 256GB SSD! Wow!

Say what you will, but this is not the Apple that drew me into their ecosystem more than a decade ago with their MBP.
If the X1X is all trousers, my 2015 will go up for sale while it can still fetch a good price. And so will the iPhone 7 and 8 and probably replace them with a Pixel 3 or a OP 6T.

 

[SDColorado]

This is so timely. My classmate's MBP 2016 died today. He is one of those hardcore Apple fans who never buys AppleCare because Apple builds reliable machines and he never needed one before. The Store told him it was a 'rare' SSD failure and it will cost nearly 700 USD incl. taxes to fix! For a 256GB SSD! Wow!

Say what you will, but this is not the Apple that drew me into their ecosystem more than a decade ago with their MBP.
If the X1X is all trousers, my 2015 will go up for sale while it can still fetch a good price. And so will the iPhone 7 and 8 and probably replace them with a Pixel 3 or a OP 6T.

Rare or not, that is the danger that comes with everything being soldered to the board. Speaking of Lenovo, looks like they charge $149 for a 256GB SSD and he could replace it himself.

Edit: Just got notice that mine shipped today from NC. I had forgotten that they opened a manufacturing plant in Whitsett, North Carolina. It should be here sooner than I thought.

 

[macintoshmac]

The two SSD's can be configured for a Raid 0/1 operation also. Two SSD slots, two memory slots, what's not to love.

Windows OS. That thing should run macOS and it will be instant nirvana for a lot of us.
[doublepost=1536210491][/doublepost]

Now that would be an interesting option!



I actually really like Windows 10 in its current iteration. I know it’s a bit sacrilege to say anywhere but here. But I keep going back and forth between using my Surface Pro and MacBook Pro to see if there is anything with MacOS that would give me serious buyers remorse if I switched all over to PC and there isn’t anything about MacOS in comparison that I would consider a deal breaker in making that change

I was burned with Windows rather hard and that is when I made the switch to macOS. I see that things have become very stable now, but there is still that thing with drivers and optimum performance levels and what not, that one needs to take care of. Plus all the nastiness of viruses, malware and such.

While I am a technical guy by education, I make my money in creativity. For that, the macOS experience is better with quality software and overall lesser drama (in my specific case).

Even then, for most of us, macOS has been an ecosystem we are invested in. All the software and such over the years that we will have to purchase fresh for Windows, if we were to switch back today.

That said, the windows machines (today more so) represent what the Mac machines are missing in terms of hardware, serviceability, repairability and dare I say, upgradeability.

The only reason I am able to use my 2011 MBP 15 today and selling my 2016 13 inch is that I had upgraded the hardware to SSD and 16GB RAM, and that has made all the difference to the longevity of my 2011 machine. This is lost since 2012 retinas I believe.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

...


The only reason I am able to use my 2011 MBP 15 today and selling my 2016 13 inch is that I had upgraded the hardware to SSD and 16GB RAM, and that has made all the difference to the longevity of my 2011 machine. This is lost since 2012 retinas I believe.

How is your 2011 still running ? Mine failed during a job interview due to GPU failure and that was the last straw. I got it repaired under warranty and sold it at a massive loss. Been pretty happy with the 2015 so far.

 

[macintoshmac]

How is your 2011 still running ? Mine failed during a job interview due to GPU failure and that was the last straw. I got it repaired under warranty and sold it at a massive loss. Been pretty happy with the 2015 so far.

GPU failure during a job interview. Wow. That must have hit below the belt and hard.

Fortunately, my MBP still performs like a champ. No GPU issues whatsoever on this one. I bought the 2016 13" only for portability and the Retina display, but the old 2011 kept me calling, and it was not because of the keyboard. It was because of the value that I was somehow not getting in the 2016.

A 2018 15" seems to be a better laptop than the 2011 in all areas, if and when I replace my 15 2011, it will be with a 15 for sure, from 2018 and up.

 

[Rockadile]

How is your 2011 still running ? Mine failed during a job interview due to GPU failure and that was the last straw. I got it repaired under warranty and sold it at a massive loss. Been pretty happy with the 2015 so far.

Were you showing off graphic work in the interview to be using dGPU?
I'd have used something like gfxCardStatus to only use integrated graphics during that time.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

Were you showing off graphic work in the interview to be using dGPU?
I'd have used something like gfxCardStatus to only use integrated graphics during that time.

I should have but did not. I was aware of the problems with this machine but I thought I will not face it cause I don’t do a lot of graphic intensive stuff. The laptop had not yet failed before this. It failed for the first time during the interview. It then proceeded to crash for a total of 3 times before my timed programming interview finished.

Thank god for auto saving code editors !

 

[Thysanoptera]

Specs: http://psref.lenovo.com/syspool/Sys/PDF/ThinkPad/ThinkPad X1 Extreme/ThinkPad_X1_Extreme_Platform_Specifications.pdf

Did you notice it lists the 5k@30Hz only through TB3, this would indicate that it has only two PCIe lanes (20Gbps).

 

[c0ppo]

And still no reviews on this one, or the P1...
But some users have received their unit, so this is really strange.

 

[hajime]

Keep waiting and waiting for reviews. I read a post about good thermal of the X1E but then some other users said that their units are noisy...

MS will then release new Surface laptops on Oct 2.

 

[SDColorado]

And still no reviews on this one, or the P1...
But some users have received their unit, so this is really strange.

I do wonder if the storms in NC are a factor in the delay in professional reviews. I have had mine for a week now, it shipped much faster than I expected and it shipped from the North Carolina assembly plant. But that was before Florence.

I don’t know the extent of the impact the storm has had on that plant or getting shipments out.

I am not a professional reviewer, nor have I had as much time to spend using it as I would have liked, but so far I do really like it.

As to the noise question in another users post. I think the cooling scheme is more aggressive than the MBP I had. I think that was a design decision made by Apple to allow the machine to get hotter and stay hotter while keeping it more silent. While the X1 Extreme I feel kicks in earlier and runs the fans a bit faster at an earlier point.

While it is louder than the MBP when the fans are running, I have also not had the issue of temps constantly having in the mid-90’s and bumping that 100c limit as I so often did with the MBP. Everything has a trade-off I guess and would prefer a machine that runs and stays cooler to one that is hotter and quieter.

That said the fan noise isn’t razor blade jet engine turbid loud, but I am sure folks used to the MBP or X1 Carbon will find it louder by comparison.

I only have my own opinion and that of my wife’s, but two out of two of us agree that while you can definitely hear the fans when they kick on, they aren’t obnoxious.

A decidedly unprofessional review, but if I can answer any other questions I will try.

Mine is the i7 2.6/16GB/512GB 4K model.

 

[hajime]

I do wonder if the storms in NC are a factor in the delay in professional reviews. I have had mine for a week now, it shipped much faster than I expected and it shipped from the North Carolina assembly plant. But that was before Florence.

I don’t know the extent of the impact the storm has had on that plant or getting shipments out.

I am not a professional reviewer, nor have I had as much time to spend using it as I would have liked, but so far I do really like it.

As to the noise question in another users post. I think the cooling scheme is more aggressive than the MBP I had. I think that was a design decision made by Apple to allow the machine to get hotter and stay hotter while keeping it more silent. While the X1 Extreme I feel kicks in earlier and runs the fans a bit faster at an earlier point.

While it is louder than the MBP when the fans are running, I have also not had the issue of temps constantly having in the mid-90’s and bumping that 100c limit as I so often did with the MBP. Everything has a trade-off I guess and would prefer a machine that runs and stays cooler to one that is hotter and quieter.

That said the fan noise isn’t razor blade jet engine turbid loud, but I am sure folks used to the MBP or X1 Carbon will find it louder by comparison.

I only have my own opinion and that of my wife’s, but two out of two of us agree that while you can definitely hear the fans when they kick on, they aren’t obnoxious.

A decidedly unprofessional review, but if I can answer any other questions I will try.

Mine is the i7 2.6/16GB/512GB 4K model.

Have you tried to use some software to change the fan speed or undervolt? I have not done any of these before.

 

[c0ppo]

@SDColorado

How does it behave by doing just some basic tasks? Office, email, browsing the web, music, etc.? Is the bottom too hot? Do fans come on by doing just those basic tasks?

I have no problems with fans when I need them (compiling for example), but if they turn on while I'm just simply typing or browsing, that kinda annoys me

 

[SDColorado]

Have you tried to use some software to change the fan speed or undervolt? I have not done any of these before.

I have not yet. I know that there is a Reddit post where a guy used a couple utilities, I forget the first, no throttle or something like that and Intel Extreme Tuning Utility and got great results. He posts his settings, but I haven’t attempted it yet.

@SDColorado

How does it behave by doing just some basic tasks? Office, email, browsing the web, music, etc.? Is the bottom too hot? Do fans come on by doing just those basic tasks?

I have no problems with fans when I need them (compiling for example), but if they turn on while I'm just simply typing or browsing, that kinda annoys me

@c0ppo

It will occasionally “woosh” a little on program start, much like the MBP, but settles down right after. I don’t find the bottom gets uncomfortably hot. I have used it several time while wearing shorts and the bottom resting on skin. Warm, but not uncomfortable.

There are also a setting in BIOS for performance vs battery life that will keep temps and fan to a minimum and also the power slider, which I have never adjusted, so I am not sure what the effects of that are.

 

[SDColorado]

Keep waiting and waiting for reviews. I read a post about good thermal of the X1E but then some other users said that their units are noisy...

MS will then release new Surface laptops on Oct 2.

I have seen conflicting posts from people such as that as well. I am more sure if some units are truly noisier than others, or if it is a matter of perception from what they were coming from before or maybe it’s a certain tone?

I know some people are bothered by scratching on a chalkboard or the squeaking of styrofoam. Neither of those bothers me at all, but the sound of a spoon hitting bowl when someone is eating cereal drives me nuts. Go figure huh? That probably bothers almost nobody but me hahaha

 

[SDColorado]

What else can I post....

Screen looks good. No unevenness as I have sometimes experienced on MBP’s. Colors are rich and at least allegedly (I have no way of testing) 100% Adobe RGB. Anti-smuge/Anti-Glare coating seems to work fairly well. Obviously it is still not matte, but less glare than I have seen on many displays.

Battery life seems to be about 8 hours of my own typical use. The fast recharge that Lenovo advertises “0-80 in 60” works better than advertised. After letting mine sit over night at 0%, I plugged it in and set a timer for 60 minutes. At the end of 60 minutes I fired it up and was greeted with an 84% charge.

Speakers are not overly loud, but loud enough. Decent sound. The Dolby vision and Dolby Amos (with headphones) are engaging when watching a movie.

Accessing the computer is easy. 7 safety screws (the type that don’t come all the way out) hold the bottom plate in place. No goofy clips to fiddle with. Very straight forward.

 

[Rockadile]

You can use Eizo's browser monitor test. https://www.eizo.be/monitor-test/
Curious about backlight bleed, color shifts, uneven brightness, etc.

I saw on anandtech that Surface book 2 panel is very good. The Lenovo Yoga did poorly.

 

[Queen6]

I have not yet. I know that there is a Reddit post where a guy used a couple utilities, I forget the first, no throttle or something like that and Intel Extreme Tuning Utility and got great results. He posts his settings, but I haven’t attempted it yet.

ThrottleStop is the tool to undervolt your CPU and unlock Turbo power limits, trust me these 8th Gen CPU's are very impressive especially the hex core's once coupled with a well designed chassis. My primary notebooks setting are all unlocked so it can seriously perform when required.

Q-6

 

[SDColorado]

ThrottleStop is the tool to undervolt your CPU and unlock Turbo power limits, trust me these 8th Gen CPU's are very impressive especially the hex core's once coupled with a well designed chassis. My primary notebooks setting are all unlocked so it can seriously perform when required.

Q-6

Throttlestop. That was the name that was escaping me when I fumbled with "no throttle" hahaha. Thanks!

 

[Queen6]

Throttlestop. That was the name that was escaping me when I fumbled with "no throttle" hahaha. Thanks!

ThrottleStop is a very powerful tool, and it can unlock systems that are deliberately throttled by some OEM's. So far all the hex core 8th Gen CPU's have benefitted from undervolting allowing them to run cooler and in some cases allow the CPU to reach higher boost frequencies.

I recommend ThrottleStop over Intel's XTU as it's too finicky, just search for the ThrottleStop Guide on Notebook Review. With undervolting you have nothing to loose and potentially a lot to gain. Unlocking Turbo limits and other advanced features you need to know exactly what your getting into as your manipulating CPU power limits.

My primary is an ASUS ROG GL703GS, this OEM listens to it's customers and delivers systems with sustainable optimal performance 3.9GHz across six cores not even close to max temp.

If I wanted a faster Mac, Jony Ive would need to design a nice bag for the iMac Pro, not sure if that's a little funny or just plain sad...

Q-6

 

[SDColorado]

If I wanted a faster Mac, Jony Ive would need to design a nice bag for the iMac Pro, not sure if that's a little funny or just plain sad...

Q-6

There is a thread in the main section about the next MBP redesign. I know for me to be interested in one, they would have to but the Pro back in MBP and make a business/workstation class machine with a larger chassis, better cooling, user serviceable/upgradable. But we know that will never happen. More likely it will be thinner still with a taptic keyboard and even more expensive upgrade tiers.

 

[Queen6]

There is a thread in the main section about the next MBP redesign. I know for me to be interested in one, they would have to but the Pro back in MBP and make a business/workstation class machine with a larger chassis, better cooling, user serviceable/upgradable. But we know that will never happen. More likely it will be thinner still with a taptic keyboard and even more expensive upgrade tiers.

Unfortunately I tend to agree, Apple dropped real interest in it's professional user base years ago. MPB is fast becoming a pretentious lifestyle product with the rest of the computing line right behind it. I know many who have switched simply due to tiring of sitting on old and or uncompetitive hardware that has drastically reduced usability, combined with round after round of design flaws that Apple steadfastly refuses to acknowledge for year upon year.

I pretty much used the MBP as my weapon of choice since it was released right through until recent years, where impressing others with time limited hardware became far more important to Apple than designing the best hardware it could. Pro with Apple simply means one thing now, more expensive nothing more, nothing less with constant nickel & diming and price gouging that impresses nobody of any intelligence.

From a professional point of view the pricing is not the issue more the value of the products, equally when spending over $6K on a notebook then having to then purchase additional power cables, adaptors, dongles etc. to simply achieve the same basic connectivity of previous models is plain insulting.

My personal opinion is Apple only wants association with professional's so it can make it's base customers feel like "Pro's" when they purchase it's overpriced product. As I've stated before I have never seen so many drop Apple and for good reason...

Q-6