MKBHD on Vision Pro

[Stevenyo]

Still use mine basically everyday, for work and play. One of the big things missing though is some of the content consumption apps. Like I've been watching a show that's only on hulu, and even with Disney+ on the AVP, I can't access hulu content from the vision pro. So that's often an hour or so a day I switch away from the Vision Pro.

It's also a major issue for me personally that there's no Apple Numbers app for Vision Pro and not even support for editing numbers sheets in safari, so to check my numbers documents, I have to connect to my mac, which is a pain sometimes

Linking to my mac works, and I use it daily, more than the monitor built into my macbook, for sure. But there's still major jank, plenty of lag, etc that allowing AVP to boot macOS, connect directly to hardware devices, or just work with other damn pointing devices would really help with (not gonna buy a lightning port based apple trackpad in 2024, hate that I can't just use existing mice for 2d pointing)

Also, regularly want to give hand input, even just a click when my hands are out of view, any sort of physical hand control, likely just a ring with a clickable thinkpad style nub, not something I have to hold, would be a nice addition, but is blocked by software limitations on pointing devices.

Any sort of "shared space," even just watching the same movie in sync, is a must for adoption outside of super single people like myself.

being able to set up different "locations" or "workspaces" would be a very welcome addition. like it should be one click to open up my "office" and one click to open my "living room" even if those use some of the same apps, and aren't geographically always the same place.

90% of the issues I have in the AVP seem to be limitations of VisionOS/software that can be fixed easily the other 10% is a full fat thunderbolt port needed to be included, for everything from connecting a wired mouse if I wanted to to Video input from a different source (I have had 6 or more devices mirrored into virtual displays in my Vision Pro, but all of them have too much latency and not enough bandwidth to do anything particularly visually intensive or exact.

The VisionPro is impressive, and only let down by Apple being Apple with some Hardware choices. VisionOS is far from where it needs to end up, but fortunately that's the part that's easier to keep working on!

 

[pugxiwawa]

It will be the same fate like every other VR headset, into the drawer it goes after a few weeks.

Using VR or AVP is an isolated experience. When people are now tied to their phones 24x7, and needing to check notifications or what's on their phone constantly, it just doesn't make senses to wear AVP and then having to constantly take it off to use the phone. Using AVP becoming a chore and you to mentally make a plan to even just use it. There's just too much friction now. Until Apple can solve or minimize that friction, AVP unforunately will remain a very niche product.

 

[Jumpthesnark]

Good evening, and welcome to another edition of I Was Bored And Wanted To Complain About The AVP.

 

[Stevenyo]

Lots of speculation of using it for immersive sports experiences, but that's a gimmick at best. Being virtually courtside or in a dugout without any real interaction is a hollow experience, and the novelty will wear off quickly.

I think you're missing the idea entirely. I don't need to be courtside virtually, I want the court on my coffee table in full 3D. To be able to pull up windows with stats, details, etc. To throw overlays onto the court while the game is going on, etc. Not a tomorrow thing, but if you can't see that a room-scale 3d environment could be as big a leap in sports broadcasting as TV was from Radio, I can't help you.

 

[Night Spring]

It's also a major issue for me personally that there's no Apple Numbers app for Vision Pro

Doesn't the iPad version work on the VP?

 

[falainber]

I'm always a bit confused when the argument is "there's just not that many apps" - it's such an unimaginative perspective. I'm getting the same use out of this as I am my Mac but with more flexibility in some areas. This with a keyboard is very productive at a desk and is a really cool way to do general computing stuff. I've got my bank apps in here, my home security stuff in here, my work collab stuff in here, Keynote works great to work on decks in here. I'm watching more movies and TV than I've ever watched because of this thing, on massive beautiful screens that are the size of my entire living room or bedroom ceiling. I'm spending hours on FaceTime with my other buddies and colleagues who have these, trading out sharing what we're seeing through our eyes via view sharing, brainstorming use cases, watching my buddy edit via his eyes on his Mac with virtual display, watching him be able to physically point at the timeline or video frame to help illustrate something, doing proof of concept commercial video shoot blocking by placing 3D objects with beautifulthings.xyz. Doing laundry, doing the dishes, cooking up some eggs and bacon, all while being able to watch a persistent piece of content in my peripheral as I do so. Playing battleship with a buddy in Game Room with our personas, and gawking at detail of the board and explosions when the missiles hit. Relaxing in the environments, or shutting out a distracting real-world to focus in on writing something or whatever you may be working on.

This thing is a really compelling computer in its own right, with a unique strength of being able to work well outside a plastic (or metal if you spring for $1500 Apple monitors) rectangle sitting on your desk. It's a new way to do everything, it sparks creativity, makes working fun again, and opens up the possibilities of what you can do in an unconventional space. I can sit on my deck, look out at the forest and have more real estate than just a tiny laptop rectangle.

"THERES NO APPS, FEED ME MORE STUFF TO DO" is a take I'd expect from a random YouTube comment, not MKBHD. But I suppose he's a busy guy and doesn't have time to slow down and appreciate this for more than the whiz-bang front-end hype experiences that may or may not exist today. More games and stuff would be nice and are coming, but there's plenty going on right now.


And for the "BUT I CAN DO THIS ON MY PHONE/TABLET/LAPTOP" people - generally being able to watch content or interact with something without having to hold a weighty metal rectangle up in my hands, whether it be in bed, in the kitchen, at my desk, on the couch, on a plane, wherever - is an amazing quality of life upgrade that feels like you just gained an extra hand.

It sounds like you just love to have this thing on your face. Most of the tasks you described are easier to do on a computer or a phone.

 

[fs454]

What’s your light seal number that makes the AVP comfortable on your face? I can’t get there even after 4 different seals.

23W - what did you scan in as originally? Ditch the dual loop and use the Solo Knit band, loosen it and slide it up and down on the back of your head until you feel completely even contact with the light seal cushion to your face, and tighten it slightly in that position just enough so it doesn't slip. The "best" position for the Solo Knit as at the top corner of your head as that pulls slightly upward on the AVP and helps with weight distro, so you want to find the light seal that sits evenly on all areas of your face with the Solo Knit resting on the upper half of the back of your head. For most people. I also find that squeezing my eyes shut and scrunching my forehead as I'm setting it on my face helps so it's not stretching your skin and comes to a rest in a spot where you're not trying to lift your eyebrows or use any face muscles to subconsciously hold it in place.

 

[fs454]

It sounds like you just love to have this thing on your face. Most the tasks you described are easier to do on a computer or a phone.

"Easier to do on a computer or phone" is the most outrageous consumer train of thought that always loses with time. When the iPhone was new to market: "Why would you want to do this on your iPhone when you can just do it on your Mac" while also ignoring the benefits that come with the new platform. When the iPad was new to market: "Why would you use an iPad when you could just do it more easily on your Mac, or on your iPhone which you already own?". Most of the tasks I described could also be done on a Chromebook or budget Windows laptop, yet I pick a 16" MacBook Pro and a Vision Pro for the same reasons you probably would also opt against the Chromebook or budget Windows laptop.

Each platform has reasons people like it, it's more fun in the AVP and it doesn't hinder me in any real way, so why not do it in a cool sci fi floating glass pane UI that can be infinitely arranged to best suit the task at hand?

 

[arfung]

Still use mine basically everyday, for work and play. One of the big things missing though is some of the content consumption apps. Like I've been watching a show that's only on hulu, and even with Disney+ on the AVP, I can't access hulu content from the vision pro. So that's often an hour or so a day I switch away from the Vision Pro.

It's also a major issue for me personally that there's no Apple Numbers app for Vision Pro and not even support for editing numbers sheets in safari, so to check my numbers documents, I have to connect to my mac, which is a pain sometimes

I watch Hulu (including live TV) by logging onto hulu.com in Safari in Vision Pro, and it works fine.

Also, I installed the iPad version of Numbers (and Pages) on Vision Pro, and so can edit sheets and Pages docs on Vision Pro without using Mac. Might want to give this a try!

 

[falainber]

"Easier to do on a computer or phone" is the most outrageous consumer train of thought that always loses with time. When the iPhone was new to market: "Why would you want to do this on your iPhone when you can just do it on your Mac" while also ignoring the benefits that come with the new platform. When the iPad was new to market: "Why would you use an iPad when you could just do it more easily on your Mac, or on your iPhone which you already own?". Most of the tasks I described could also be done on a Chromebook or budget Windows laptop, yet I pick a 16" MacBook Pro and a Vision Pro for the same reasons you probably would also opt against the Chromebook or budget Windows laptop.

Each platform has reasons people like it, it's more fun in the AVP and it doesn't hinder me in any real way, so why not do it in a cool sci fi floating glass pane UI that can be infinitely arranged to best suit the task at hand?

Your comparison between iPhone and a computer is way off base. Firstly, nobody was saying this about iPhone when it was released. Secondly, a phone and a computer have totally different use cases: one is mobile and another is used at home/office. I would not recommend you using a phone for, say, spreadsheets at home if you have a computer. iPad is a computer for sofa. Media consumption is its main use case. Yes there are iPad enthusiasts who claim it's a productivity tool but in reality they first convert iPad into a [bad] computer by attaching a keyboard and a mouse/trackpad to it. The use cases for all three categories are well defined. With AVP, you sound like an iPad productivity enthusiast: they have been trying for years that iPad for productivity is a thing. They keep failing.

You pick up MacBook over Chromebook or Windows laptop because of the performance and OS preference (most people make a different choice). You are using AVP as a poor monitor replacement. It's not mobile (not in this scenario). It offers 4K resolution against 4K, 5K, 8K, 12K resolution available with single or multiple displays. It creates massive problems with typing and peripheral devices in general. And it sits on your face.

 

[Dovahkiing]

...or the 77" OLED TV you could get for 50-80% the price of AVP

I can’t bring a 77” OLED when I travel.

Also the comfort thing is super subjective. I totally understand some people can’t take it - but for me personally it’s perfectly fine to wear for several hours, and after 30 seconds you forget about the change/reduction in FoV

 

[TechnoMonk]

It sounds like you just love to have this thing on your face. Most of the tasks you described are easier to do on a computer or a phone.

I dont have AVP, but waiting for most likely V2. Working on my 16 MBP is a pain when i am traveling. I will take an AVP with large screens on the go for working in the hotels/Flights or on the move. I don’t think AVP is there yet, but would love to ditch my laptop screen.

 

[fs454]

Your comparison between iPhone and a computer is way off base. Firstly, nobody was saying this about iPhone when it was released. Secondly, a phone and a computer have totally different use cases: one is mobile and another is used at home/office. I would not recommend you using a phone for, say, spreadsheets at home if you have a computer. iPad is a computer for sofa. Media consumption is its main use case. Yes there are iPad enthusiasts who claim it's a productivity tool but in reality they first convert iPad into a [bad] computer by attaching a keyboard and a mouse/trackpad to it. The use cases for all three categories are well defined. With AVP, you sound like an iPad productivity enthusiast: they have been trying for years that iPad for productivity is a thing. They keep failing.

You pick up MacBook over Chromebook or Windows laptop because of the performance and OS preference (most people make a different choice). You are using AVP as a poor monitor replacement. It's not mobile (not in this scenario). It offers 4K resolution against 4K, 5K, 8K, 12K resolution available with single or multiple displays. It creates massive problems with typing and peripheral devices in general. And it sits on your face.

There's great joy in using a 42" LG OLED (or a bigger one if you wish) as a monitor, even though you could take a huge technical dump all over the specs with an equivalently priced "proper" 27" 5K monitor. The AVP is a superior experience to this and it's portable with the display able to be any position in space. "Poor" is subjective. I work with video for a living and AVP has so far primarily served to show that there's finally a platform where the viewer can easily see the limitations of current 4K deliverables for TV and movies and gives true incentive to start shooting double that wherever possible for a near future where these are more widely adopted/affordable.

And I don't know what bone you have to pick here about people legitimately using and enjoying their Vision Pro, but your view really feels like one based on an unwillingness to give it a real fair shake. I sit at my desk with a Magic Keyboard and work directly in visionOS between Safari, Messages, Mail, Calendar, Files, Slack, Juno, and all the random odds and ends apps (Blink home security, banking apps etc) I typically have on my phone. The touch keyboard is not for productivity, and if you didn't give it enough of a chance with a Magic Keyboard that's unfortunate. I simply don't feel like this is a worse way to work, and when I need to open a Premiere Pro project, quickly modify the layout of a PDF file or otherwise I can jump into my MBP all in the same workflow.

 

[AdonisSMU]

Of course Marques Brownlee doesn't use his AVP everyday. He's a human, not a robot. Did you all know once upon a time people didn't have the Internet, cell phones, and Internet cell phones? No one needs an AVP in their life. You survived before the AVP was sold.

People also survived without computers and phones and any and all technology that exists today. That’s not a special or different opinion. Meanwhile I use my avp more now than when I first bought it

 

[turbineseaplane]

I can’t bring a 77” OLED when I travel.

Also the comfort thing is super subjective. I totally understand some people can’t take it - but for me personally it’s perfectly fine to wear for several hours, and after 30 seconds you forget about the change/reduction in FoV

Very true about travel!

Also can't watch something together with your family or a house party with just an AVP

Different products - no question!

 

[tornadowrangler]

I think comparing AVP to any other product just creates a false analogy. It is completely unlike any other product Apple has made, and thus you can't use the success of other Apple products as evidence that the AVP will do so.

Of course, none of us know how it will turn out. I just know that I did not doubt the success of the iPhone, iPad, or any other previous Apple product that ended up successful, but I do doubt the success of the AVP. Or maybe I should say, I doubt a wide adoption.

Because what does success look like for the AVP? It could be considered successful even with a small amount of users. After all, jackhammers are a pretty successful product, but I don't have one or know anyone that does.

 

[G5isAlive]

That doesn't negate his comment about comfort, especially if talking about wearing AVP for the length of a movie

If he doesn’t own one or hasn’t tried one it totally negates his and others who haven’t tried one comment on comfort. If all you’re doing is cherry picking comments to support your agenda you aren’t adding to the conversation.

I watched passengers in 3d last night on my AVP and never once thought it was uncomfortable.

 

[G5isAlive]

Very true about travel!

Also can't watch something together with your family or a house party with just an AVP

Different products - no question!

And I can’t often bring my family and friends with me when I travel for work, guess I’ll just have to stop traveling.

Just because it doesn’t fit all use cases doesn’t mean it doesn’t fit some use cases and has a place.

 

[G5isAlive]

I think there's two basic outlooks toward the VP. One is seeing It as something that's supposed to provide new experiences made possible by VR/AR technology. The other is seeing it as just another way to do regular computing tasks, only a little bit more conveniently or more pleasantly. The first group is going to keep waiting for more apps and content, while the second group chugs along actually using the VP.

This. I use mine daily because I enjoy using it. Most but not all of the things I can do on some combo of Mac and iPad, but I enjoy the experience of the AVP. No killer app required.

 

[0s and 1s]

I might be an old man millennial, but why do we put so much weight on an influencer?

Either the AVP works for your needs or it doesn’t. Why so much weight on his words?

 

[ThomasJL]

Tim Cook is such a joke. Not even one groundbreaking product has been introduced during the 12 years he's been CEO. He's constantly trying to jump on the latest tech industry bandwagon, which in 2013 was Microsoft-promoted flat design and now is Meta-promoted VR goggles.

 

[Ghost31]

Tim Cook is such a joke. Not even one groundbreaking product has been introduced during the 12 years he's been CEO. He's constantly trying to jump on the latest tech industry bandwagon, which in 2013 was Microsoft-promoted flat design and now is Meta-promoted VR goggles.

I meannnn there was the Apple Watch which ended up being THE most sold watch in the world that set the standard for smart watches. There were airpods which could be a Fortune 500 company by itself on volume and sales alone which ushered in the era of “truly wireless headphones”. There’s Vision Pro which is in its early stages. Time will tell.

But Jesus Christ man. What ground breaking product were you looking for apple to make that they didnt?

 

[fatTribble]

I meannnn there was the Apple Watch which ended up being THE most sold watch in the world that set the standard for smart watches. There were airpods which could be a Fortune 500 company by itself on volume and sales alone which ushered in the era of “truly wireless headphones”. There’s Vision Pro which is in its early stages. Time will tell.

But Jesus Christ man. What ground breaking product were you looking for apple to make that they didnt?

You give some great examples. I’ve always respected the way Apple will watch what’s going on in a particular market then later release a superior product. Being first might make points with some people, but only in the short term.

 

[TechnoMonk]

I might be an old man millennial, but why do we put so much weight on an influencer?

Either the AVP works for your needs or it doesn’t. Why so much weight on his words?

Well said. I evaluate all products, if it doesn’t work for me, I send it back. I rarely put any weight to reviewers or influencers.

 

[djcerla]

Airports, flights.

That's where this product will start to blossom. A portable oasis of peace in the mess of travel is a very compelling proposition.