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BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
8,775
10,900
There is big difference between the level of corporate work you're talking about and small businesses that need people to run the place.
So? Are you shifting the goalposts to now say it’s delusional or absurd for some small businesses?

I think it would be hard for some businesses, but they’d adapt just like they do on other countries.
 

Macative

Suspended
Mar 7, 2022
834
1,319
So? Are you shifting the goalposts to now say it’s delusional or absurd for some small businesses?
Nope. I still think 5 weeks off out of 52 is absurd for any profession where you are employed and paid a salary.
But for other people who think this kind of thing should be offered to McDonalds workers, I clarified the level of absurdity.
 

BaldiMac

macrumors G3
Jan 24, 2008
8,775
10,900
Nope. I still think 5 weeks off out of 52 is absurd for any profession where you are employed and paid a salary.
But for other people who think this kind of thing should be offered to McDonalds workers, I clarified the level of absurdity.
Sure, but you’ve offered no explanation for why you believe that. You’ve simply called it absurd even though it is common.
 

sudo-sandwich

Suspended
Aug 5, 2021
671
558
You're paying people to work, not sit home for 5 weeks out of the year. That's insane.
So you pay them 47 weeks a year instead of 49 or 52, big deal. Same hourly rate, lower yearly income. Yeah you might technically send the paycheck during the 5 weeks off, depending on the type of employee, but there are strings attached. They aren't actually being paid to sit at home.
 

ForkHandles

macrumors 6502
Jun 8, 2012
458
1,099
No actually I agree that it is about achieving a balance, and history HAS shown abuses can be remedied by union representation. Good, healthy companies do not actively work against their employees' interests. I am not suggesting that there is not abuse, especially in industries where there are few (if any) alternatives for workers with a specific skillset. There I can see good arguments for union representation.

You state that shift patterns are lousy for Apple retail employees. I can empathize with that as my wife works in a system where her shifts are all over the place. As with everything in life there are tradeoffs. Is working for Apple, the salary, benefits, etc worth is to deal with the shift issue? My wife has decided that yes, the tradeoff is currently worth it, but she is always on the lookout for something better. So to me, the natural consequence is high turnover. Turnover (employee satisfaction) is the a cost/benefit calculation for Apple. Are these retail employees shackled to Apple?
Agreed.

But wouldn’t it be nice if all your wife’s colleagues got together and said ‘Oi! We don’t mind shifts but keep them regular and constant, that way I can plan a great life too. ‘

The employer would save money on rehiring, the employee would have a better life. Everyone would win.

Simplistic I know, but definitely a positive.
 

maxoakland

macrumors 6502a
Oct 6, 2021
709
1,007
There is no "if". It's literally what happens. Do you really not know that people take advantage of absolutely everything they can, everywhere they can? And I have no idea what "laws" you're referring to, that's completely out of context here. What you're responding to is in response to typical tripe of U.S. businesses working people to do death and having outrageous expectations like showing up for work when you are supposed to.

We already see dozens of countries in Europe, Scandinavia, and the UK who have implemented these laws. People are happier and businesses flourish

It’s anti-American to say that we can’t do the same thing in America and it’s also completely illogical. Seems like you must hate Americans if you think we can’t have the bare minimum that all those other countries have
 
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Nicky G

macrumors 65816
Mar 24, 2002
1,148
1,284
Baltimore
The Chinese Communist Party is about as aptly named as Democratic People's Republic of Korea. Lots of capital accumulation going on in China for a single-party communist state.
Oh, agreed. Not much of a "Communism" if there's billionaires and poor people, at least if I understood my Marx and Engels correctly.
 

rgwebb

macrumors 6502
Nov 27, 2005
430
1,160
Oh, agreed. Not much of a "Communism" if there's billionaires and poor people, at least if I understood my Marx and Engels correctly.
Of course, they only have markets and individual surplus accumulation to motivate industry to defeat global capitalism.

At least that's what the now very rich party members say. 😁
 
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sudo-sandwich

Suspended
Aug 5, 2021
671
558
mmmmmmmmbullcrap.

LOL

working class unions own Biden?



Joe Biden telling his Wall st. buddies and corporate investors “Nothing is going to fundamentally change”
Yes they do. United Auto Workers represents working-class people, but its leaders are not working-class of course, and the union as a whole is very powerful. The Big Three is not allowed to collude, but UAW is in all three.
 
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sudo-sandwich

Suspended
Aug 5, 2021
671
558
Whoa is this a popular thing now? I haven't been inside a fast restaurant in a long time.
Yes, it's very common now. Even some sit-down restaurants do orders by phone. If the place requires me to use the phone or kiosk, I go somewhere else.
 
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Macative

Suspended
Mar 7, 2022
834
1,319
So you pay them 47 weeks a year instead of 49 or 52, big deal. Same hourly rate, lower yearly income. Yeah you might technically send the paycheck during the 5 weeks off, depending on the type of employee, but there are strings attached. They aren't actually being paid to sit at home.
They are literally being paid to sit home. That's just mental gymnastics.
 

Marli

macrumors 6502
Apr 9, 2011
381
272
Yep. These kind of perks just fall down from the sky if you wish for it…

Or if you have a strong union 😎

And trust me. It’s not like the companies in my country are close to bankruptcy. They’re doing quite well.
These are mandated here.. long before any union. It actually goes back to european colonisation, and the time it took to go home via ship.

Unions are dinosaurs, from the industrial revolution...
 

seek3r

macrumors 68020
Aug 16, 2010
2,271
3,232
So, lower staffing level per orders filled per day.
Which is fine because it doesnt create a sudden massive set of new job seekers. There’s no layoffs involved. The job market isnt a zero sum gain, it can handle increased productivity without job loss a lot more easily than increases in unemployment
 

seek3r

macrumors 68020
Aug 16, 2010
2,271
3,232
They are literally being paid to sit home. That's just mental gymnastics.
Not really, my wife’s a teacher at a private school, she has a choice of getting her pay in larger sums throughout the school year or the same money in slightly smaller paychecks spaced out with pay over the summer (not counting additional pay for summer PDs or dept planning work which is handled seperately). The latter is the same pay as the former but the consistency of regular checks year round makes budgeting easier.
 

rgwebb

macrumors 6502
Nov 27, 2005
430
1,160
Not really, my wife’s a teacher at a private school, she has a choice of getting her pay in larger sums throughout the school year or the same money in slightly smaller paychecks spaced out with pay over the summer (not counting additional pay for summer PDs or dept planning work which is handled seperately). The latter is the same pay as the former but the consistency of regular checks year round makes budgeting easier.
My wife is a public educator and her school district - and all others in this state that I'm aware of - pay out the 9mo contract over 12mo.
 
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seek3r

macrumors 68020
Aug 16, 2010
2,271
3,232
My wife is a public educator and her school district - and all others in this state that I'm aware of - pay out the 9mo contract over 12mo.
It really does make budgeting easier, that’s the option my wife has always taken
 

sudo-sandwich

Suspended
Aug 5, 2021
671
558
Which is fine because it doesnt create a sudden massive set of new job seekers. There’s no layoffs involved. The job market isnt a zero sum gain, it can handle increased productivity without job loss a lot more easily than increases in unemployment
That's under the assumption that all restaurants are expanding business, which by itself means good times.
 

lindros2

macrumors 6502a
Mar 21, 2011
829
492
My wife is a public educator and her school district - and all others in this state that I'm aware of - pay out the 9mo contract over 12mo.
Ah teachers unions. Hundreds of millions in social cause lobbying.

 

rgwebb

macrumors 6502
Nov 27, 2005
430
1,160

lindros2

macrumors 6502a
Mar 21, 2011
829
492
Okay? What does that have to do with anything I said in your quote?
Unions are in business to fund politicians who push for unions.

Vice President Kamala Harris praised the NEA on Tuesday.

"NEA, you are extraordinarily effective as a group advocate for change, which is why we know that you have been able to see the success you have achieved. And it is no surprise why, because we know unions know how to organize," she said.
 

rgwebb

macrumors 6502
Nov 27, 2005
430
1,160
Unions are in business to fund politicians who push for unions.

Vice President Kamala Harris praised the NEA on Tuesday.

"NEA, you are extraordinarily effective as a group advocate for change, which is why we know that you have been able to see the success you have achieved. And it is no surprise why, because we know unions know how to organize," she said.
Oh I see, you have some pet political agenda and want someone to spare with on the internet. I’m going to pass. Have a good one!
 

ninecows

macrumors 6502a
Apr 9, 2012
651
1,047
Unions are in business to fund politicians who push for unions.

Vice President Kamala Harris praised the NEA on Tuesday.

"NEA, you are extraordinarily effective as a group advocate for change, which is why we know that you have been able to see the success you have achieved. And it is no surprise why, because we know unions know how to organize," she said.
Yeah… at least the leaders of big tech, pharma, arms, tobacco, financial and oil industry etc are doing none of that. They just sit quietly in the corner and wish politicians would not make legislation that could reduce their profit.
 
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