Apple to Release Mac Pro and Pro Display XDR on December 10

[bernuli]

I don’t get this view. Who is looking at a $5K display as a serious consideration but then saying “oh the stand costs more”.

Oh that’s right. No one. No one is going to just buy the pro display because it’s apple and they want an apple display, not at the price it is. I’m not saying it’s expensive for what it is, I’m saying it’s expensive compared to “mainstream” and even “Pro” displays like the UltraFines etc.

I actually understand people who just want an apple display at the “Cinema Display” price point - but when your complaint is “yeah $5k is fine but no stand? Rip off” it’s clear the comment is just another throw away meaningless comment.

Having said that: to those who do just want an apple at the “Cinema Display” price points: I suggest you dip your toe and try one of the other options on the market. As they say, “the waters fine”.

Yeah, that is not what I was saying. Nice tangent thought!

 

[alexandr]

It is not the only option, just the one display made by Apple. They sell other less expensive displays. Why is that insulting? It is very well priced monitor, compared to its actual competition (substantially cheaper).

thanks, i was speaking of displays made by apple.

 

[mdriftmeyer]

Some states, like TX and AZ that I am familiar with, electricity is cheap. My state, CA, is definitely something to think about as your electric bill will cause sticker shock when you get it! But, living in CA, I'm used to sticker shock on basically everything.

Power is dirt cheap up here in WA State.

 

[alexandr]

I get both of you points.
in one hand if sales are great, there is a great chance Apple will continue develop and update the MP/displays.
if sales are crap, then we can very well see Apple abandoning altogether, despite lowering their prices, something Apple usually don’t go for it.
So, I hope they are a success.

ok, in that case - let it be a huge success!

 

[Alan Wynn]

Blended margin? For Apple, my assumption (could be wrong) is that anything under 30% would be “not very profitable“ for them, but quite profitable by the rest of the industry standard. I can’t imagine that Apple does anything with a razor thin margin.

While I do not know the margins of this machine, Apple’s usual margins are around 25%. On some versions of the Mac Mini, the base configuration was not profitable, but was in the line because they needed it to hit a price point, and most people upgraded from there.

 

[alexandr]

Are you saying that they should not create specialized high end products, or just that they should also try to compete in the commodity market where for their monitors, they would be much more expensive than their competition (it would never be a high volume item for them)?

again - the second. who cares that their monitors would be more expensive, we already know that in most cases we're paying more just because it's apple - and i'm perfectly fine with that, because i love the os and the design enough to pay more for it.

There is a big difference between feeling disappointment and feeling insulted.

ok, i'll withdraw the insult portion. better?)

 

[gugy]

Can you explain in more detail? I am wondering why a MP for your needs is $11K, given that your needs can apparently be met by a maxed out MBP?

Well I am waiting to find out the BTO.
I’m assuming 128gb RAM, 4tb storage and the next update GPU might bring the workstation close to $11k.
while the MBP at 64gb, 4tb storage and top of the line GPU and processor, will be around $5k.
this workstation will be for design, motion graphics and 3D.

 

[Internet Enzyme]

Its worth pointing out, 999$ isn’t crazy for what it is. It’s just ... maybe not marketing’s finest hour over there

I think that pros are willing to pay $999, and I agree: they probably should have left this for the configurator—although that may have also been a pr blunder as the media would almost certainly interpret that as a purposefully cynical lack of disclosure on Apple's part.

 

[throAU]

Finally. All several hundred people can buy the Pro and we can stop hearing about “when will they update it”

Just in time to be obliterated by 64 core Threadripper in the next couple of months.

 

[mithion]

Really cool computer but damn it’s not for the mere mortals. Built a 25 node, 800core cluster with 1.6TB of ram and 12TB of storage about 10 years ago for a little more than the cost of a maxed out Mac Pro. Now you get probably the same performance in 1/25th the size lol. Amazing!

 

[smulji]

dream on The pro and those mpx modules wont get an update for ages, if ever. We dont even know if there will be ever a next mac pro.

What makes you so sure?

 

[mdriftmeyer]

Will this count?

https://bizon-tech.com/bizon-v9000.html

Starting at $6,290

• Processor:2nd Gen 2019 Dual 8-Core 2.10 GHz Intel Xeon Silver 4210 (Up to 56 Cores)
• Memory: 32 GB DDR4 2666 MHz ECC Buffered Memory (up to 1 TB)
• Graphics Card: NVIDIA RTX 2080 SUPER (optional 4 x Titan V or RTX 2080 Ti or Quadro RTX)
• SSD: 250 GB PCI-E SSD (Up to 4 TB SSD)
• Additional HDD: 4 TB HDD (Up to 9 x 12 TB HDD)
• 10 Gbit LAN, SATA-3, RAID, USB 3.0, USB 3.1, M.2 PCI-E.
• Case: Rackmountable. Horizontal or vertical placement.

No that doesn't count. The

To be clear, nothing on the market touches the Apple Afterburner which come Tuesday has upped it's capabilties to six simultaneous 8K 30fps video files chewing through w/o touching the infinity fabric GPGPUs and their 3 TB3 ports on each 32 GB HBM2 based GPUs, and up to 4 Vega Pro Duo Cards or

128 GB HBM2 Memory, 12 TB 3 ports all directly interfaced via the Infinity Fabric back plane that directly interfaces with the full bandwidth of PCI-E 3.0.

Apple can leverage every single aspect of those GPGPUs and their optimized Metal 2 Stack which Nvidia can't even turn over and leverage because Nvidia doesn't support Metal, period.

Here are a few updates on the Mac Pro and Mac Pro Rack solutions.

http://www.fcp.co/final-cut-pro/art...-mount-specs-and-more-pro-display-xdr-details

Do I want Apple to move to 64 Core / 128 Threads Threadripper CPUS with those 4 GPGPU cards via the MPX modules? Yep.

But here is the kicker: the single most expensive part of this machine to max it out is THE RAM.

128GB LR-DIMM chips.

Yesterday prices were NOT ON SALE. Suddenly, with the Mac Pro's arrival they all go on a blister sale at Newegg.

https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?d=128+GB+LR-DIMM&N=100007952 601322221&name=Server Memory&isdeptsrh=1

It sure looks like NEMIX is hoping to cash in early.

12 DIMMS will normally set you back at more than $25k, but for the brief moment they're will to cut over 40% off right now.

I doubt Apple secures that memory from NEMIX and most likely Samsung, SK-Hynix, Crucial or even directly from Micron.

https://www.samsung.com/semiconductor/dram/module/M386AAG40MM2-CVF/

The Threadripper 3990x probably would drop the system by $4500-$5000, add PCI-E 4.x and put testing and release back an additional 12 months.

My bet is Apple wants to get to Zen 3 before pulling the trigger and the 7nm+ TSMC Fab process.

https://www.wepc.com/news/amd-zen-3-7nm/

Having the AMD CPUs and GPGPUs with the successor to Vega VII in the RDNA II architecture and the option for HBM2e memory that more than doubles capacity, reduces power consumption by 30% and more will all finally have Apple pulling the trigger at the successor to the new Mac Pro.

This Mac Pro has been in design for 5 years so you aren't going to jump ship 3 years into it hoping AMD hits it out of the park. Now that AMD has the Zen 3 stamping out and very soon in the hands of OEMs Apple can in-house produce a Threadripper/EPYC option Zen 3 design for the Tower/Rack configurations.

Threadripper supports up to 2 TB of DDR4, though all motherboard designers cap at 256GB presently.

 

[smulji]

That’s what I suspect. Nobody will want or need the base model, but they will end up getting some variation of the base model. For example, someone creating music may upgrade the ram and processor but leave the graphics card untouched. A 3D modeller may upgrade the graphics but leave the 8-core processor as is.

There’s reason to offer a baseline Mac Pro even if nobody will end up purchasing one in its current incarnation.

The base $5,999 model exists for a reason => it’s for those buyers who will use it in a rack-mount server setting. They don’t need the fastest CPU or the terabytes of storage. Those who need more will buy more.

 

[Apples Apples Everywhere]

The maxed out Mac Mini is $3,099...

And it was over $4000 when I first bought it. If it had an internal Vega I’d skip the Mac Pro.

 

[throAU]

What makes you so sure?

History of the previous model and Apple's current inability to execute.

They announced this thing, with mostly off-the-shelf parts in what... June? It's now December, it still isn't out, and in the interim CPU performance from AMD has accelerated past it.

Literally the only hardware in this box that is in any way impressive at this point is the ASIC, and thats very application specific. The CPUs are now (well, in early 2020) mid-tier (in terms of workstation specs), the GPUs are nowhere near the top end, etc.

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The base $5,999 model exists for a reason => it’s for those buyers who will use it in a rack-mount server setting. They don’t need the fastest CPU or the terabytes of storage. Those who need more will buy more.

So, there's a rack mount kit for it this time?

Buying more storage from Apple is insane. You may as well buy another/multiple 10+ gigabit ethernet card and a small all-flash SAN for less.

 

[Macbookprodude]

Apple plans to release the new Mac Pro and the Pro Display XDR on Tuesday, December 10, according to "Save the Date" emails that Apple began sending out to some customers this afternoon.

Apple in November confirmed that the Mac Pro and Pro Display XDR would come in December, but until now, the company had not provided a specific date. Apple's emails say orders will begin on December 10, so presumably shipments will begin soon after orders open up.

The new modular Mac Pro was first introduced in June at the WorldWide developers Conference, with the machine aimed at Apple's pro user base.

The Mac Pro was designed with a heavy focus on upgradeability and expansion, and it features a traditional PC shape with an Apple-esque stainless steel frame with a lattice pattern that maximizes airflow.

Internal specs include workstation-class Xeon processors with up to 28 cores, up to 1.5TB of high-performance memory, up to two Radeon Pro II Duo GPUs, and eight PCIe expansion slots, along with an Apple Afterburner accelerator card.

Pricing on the Mac Pro will start at $6,000, and will go up based on configuration. The base Mac Pro features an 8-core Xeon W chip.

Apple plans to sell the Mac Pro alongside the Pro Display XDR, a 6K display with a resolution of 6016 x 3384 and more than 20 million pixels. Pricing on the Pro Display XDR starts at $5,000, with an add-on stand priced at $999.

(Thanks, Ryan!)

Article Link: Apple to Release Mac Pro and Pro Display XDR on December 10

Overpriced junk... 6000 ??? My Mac Pro 2010-2012 didn't cost that much and its still going strong !
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Finally some news.
Not like I’ll be able to afford it anyways. A base workstation with display will be around $14k. Ouch.
i hope I can qualify for a 24m 0% interest. That way, maybe.

Thats the point.. The Mac Pro is too high for most if not all people.. Wait 10 years and it will be 500.00 - but by then who knows what will be. 80 percent of people on here can't afford it.
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What makes you so sure?

The Mac Pro is a niche very niche product at best and does NOT make Apple rich.. their main business if the consumer side, iPhones, iwatches etc.

 

[realtuner]

They have no understanding of Rendering if they believe 8 cores/16 threads will match 32/64 cores. It will demolish an 8 core system. A thousand cores/2 thousand threads would render most 8k cells in near real-time. Combined with the GPGPU it absolutely will obliterate an 8 core/16 thread with the same GPGPU.

RenderFarms exist for a reason.

I don't recall anyone ever claiming an 8 core processor would match a 32 core processor. The complaint I heard was that a 32 core processor would be 4X as fast as an 8 core processor just because it has 4x the number of cores. The Threadripper 2990WX is actually made up of 4 dies and they don't all get unrestricted access to memory controllers, which limits the ability of all cores to run flat out. Threadripper also has 4 channel memory controller to the Xeons 6 channels. You never get perfectly linear scaling with additional cores even with workloads that can be neatly divided up among multiple cores.

 

[Macbookprodude]

For anyone that thinks this computer is rediculous and costs too much, its not for you. I would love this machine and will probably end up with one. It’s a tax write-off, and those that can benifit from its power, and make enough, are the ones that this is for. Period.

Which is less than 10% on this whole board and also in the world..

 

[dmylrea]

The base $5,999 model exists for a reason => it’s for those buyers who will use it in a rack-mount server setting. They don’t need the fastest CPU or the terabytes of storage. Those who need more will buy more.

What would you do with it in a rack-mount server setting? macOS Server is a joke!

 

[Tech198]

maximize airflow.. This think is gonna get hot.

So, order begin December 10th.. some lucky buggers will get them before 25th.

 

[throAU]

I don't recall anyone ever claiming an 8 core processor would match a 32 core processor. The complaint I heard was that a 32 core processor would be 4X as fast as an 8 core processor just because it has 4x the number of cores. The Threadripper 2990WX is actually made up of 4 dies and they don't all get unrestricted access to memory controllers, which limits the ability of all cores to run flat out. Threadripper also has 4 channel memory controller to the Xeons 6 channels. You never get perfectly linear scaling with additional cores even with workloads that can be neatly divided up among multiple cores.

The 2990WX is last generation, the 3960-3970X are UMA not NUMA and do not have that problem.

The 39xx Threadrippers have much bigger cache than Xeon, larger memory support (?), higher clocks and better iPC. Currently the 3970x is 32 core, there's 64 core coming in q1 2020.

And if Threadripper isn't enough, EPYC is 8 channel memory, etc...

In many tasks, the 28 core Xeon is outperformed by AMD's 24 core 3960x. In some tasks, it is outperformed by the 16 core Ryzen 3950X.

 

[beaker7]

Just in time to be obliterated by 64 core Threadripper in the next couple of months.

Already obliterated by the 32 core Threadripper.

 

[redheeler]

I'm reading this forum on a 30" ACD. When it came out in 2004, it was $3299. That's $4,500 in today's dollars, although it did come with a stand. I think mine is from about 2009, and I paid $450 for it in 2013. I can't believe how good it still looks. I have two, and neither has a single solitary missing pixel. My guess is that if you just buy the monitor and use it, you'll love it for many years.

I use a 30" Apple Cinema Display to watch TV. It is decent but no substitute for a modern display like the one on my 5K iMac. The difference in quality is very noticeable.

 

[basehead617]

While not all workstation offer dual sockets, the high end ones (from Lenovo, Dell, HP, Supermicro, ASUS etc.) definitely have dual socket configurations. They offer 2x CPUs and up to 2x (3TB) RAM configurations compared to Mac Pro.

I just speced out a Dual Xeon 8180 from Dell and it was $31,000 with only 64gb ram and 256 GB SSD

 

[throAU]

Already obliterated by the 32 core Threadripper.

Haha.

Beaten. I wouldn't quite say "obliterated" (yet), but yes, significantly beaten except for a few niche tasks that typically aren't mac pro markets.

But yes, when 64 core is out in q1, we're definitely looking at a much greater than 2x performance delta. And intel simply have nothing competitive in the pipe coming until 2021-2022 at the earliest.