Apple to Release Mac Pro and Pro Display XDR on December 10

[realtuner]

https://www.asus.com/me-en/Motherboards/ROG-Dominus-Extreme/specifications/

I am not very good with mobo.. but anyway, is it good enough?

Still not there.

First off, for some reason this MB only allows 192GB of RAM. Seems very odd to me to have 12 DIMM slots and only have the ability to have a total of 192GB of RAM. It also has 4 PCI slots vs 8 in the Mac Pro and 1 10G LAN vs 2 in the Mac Pro. That's just a few obvious ones to start. The Mac Pro has the MPX slots to power the modules directly without needing extra cables.

And this MB originally listed for $1,799 when it came out.

 

[Macbookprodude]

To be fair, @Promostyle later amended his comment, see post #88. But I disagree with the “only FCPX and LPX” characterization of 2019 MP buyers. I think there will be much wider interest in this machine, and I think it will do surprisingly well.

But the monitor is (mostly) for those who need a high-end, color-calibrated display, so mostly video, also graphics artists and photogs who deal with digital color reproduction... printing/publishing etc. If it performs as advertised, it’s a steal.

How many people really in this country have that much money ? Take Ukraine for instance where I am from, we are poor in the streets, the only reason why I have a 2010 Mac Pro and other machines is because I am a security guard for the gov't in Ukraine. I agree with most Americans on here - this machine is overpriced and normal Americans couldn't afford it like the 2010/2012 Mac Pro which is cheaper now. I suppose in 10 years from now, maybe it will be 500.00 or 1000.00 and the monitor is TOO DAMN HIGH also.. plus, will it work with a 2010-2012 Mac Pro ? I doubt it.
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The fact that you're having to scavenge six and ten year old machines to do your work says everything about Apple's commitment to the professional market.

The new machine, in itself, does not mark the return of Apple to professional hardware. That only comes if we see incremental improvements next year, the year after, and so on.

The "trash can" was once lauded by Apple as the future of professional hardware. Look how that turned out.

And this one also will fail because the price is too high.

 

[cmaier]

How many people really in this country have that much money ? Take Ukraine for instance where I am from, we are poor in the streets, the only reason why I have a 2010 Mac Pro and other machines is because I am a security guard for the gov't in Ukraine. I agree with most Americans on here - this machine is overpriced and normal Americans couldn't afford it like the 2010/2012 Mac Pro which is cheaper now. I suppose in 10 years from now, maybe it will be 500.00 or 1000.00 and the monitor is TOO DAMN HIGH also.. plus, will it work with a 2010-2012 Mac Pro ? I doubt it.

It‘s not meant for “normal Americans” to buy. It’s meant for businesses to buy, or individuals who can recoup the cost quickly because they make money using the device.

 

[beaker7]

Haha.

Beaten. I wouldn't quite say "obliterated" (yet), but yes, significantly beaten except for a few niche tasks that typically aren't mac pro markets.

But yes, when 64 core is out in q1, we're definitely looking at a much greater than 2x performance delta. And intel simply have nothing competitive in the pipe coming until 2021-2022 at the earliest.

Being beaten by 60% at launch by a $2000 processor feels ‘obliterated’ to me, but hey, potato potahto.

 

[Macbookprodude]

Finally I will be able to open up a 4th Chrome Tab without issue!

You can do that on a fully expanded 5,1
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TRANSLATION: I really, really, REALLY want one and I’m pissed that I can’t afford it! And I’m pissed that others can!

What do u use it for ? I see you are in Russia, I am in Lviv.. Hi.. We Slavs can barely feed ourselves and you wish to have this ? Your not in America.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

it is nonsense that the motherboard is way faster than a good pc motherboard.

There was a PC site, can’t remember and not bothered to look right now that tried to do an honest comparison, building out a system that matched the reported specifications of the Mac Pro. They found that many of the reported features just aren’t able to be replicated for ANY price.

then at time of purchase allow people to just purchase the display at a cheaper price

No, it really doesn’t matter WHEN the story got out, a $999 monitor stand is eminently memeable. They owned it and put it out there. ANY other way of bringing it out would have been them not owning it or shying away from it which would have been worse

surprised if this new Mac Pro is outdated very quickly

I’d be surprised if any technology isn’t outdated very quickly.

You’d be wrong

Ok, point taken! So, their low end Mac Pro systems are more like “at cost?”

 

[-narcan-]

Because many pros actually can’t afford or justify $12,000.

I guess if you can't justify the purchase, then it's not worth worrying about ?

 

[Onelifenofear]

I think that pros are willing to pay $999, and I agree: they probably should have left this for the configurator—although that may have also been a pr blunder as the media would almost certainly interpret that as a purposefully cynical lack of disclosure on Apple's part.

agree - should have been 6k which really is cheap for a reference monitor (my last one was 18k second hand) and then have the price DROP if you selected the vesa mount.

I’d always want the vesa as ergonimocally looking down is bad.

 

[Macbookprodude]

So they are just supposed to waste money if they don't need the extra hardware? Businesses exist to make as much money as possible. If they do not need more than 8 cores, why waste money paying for more?

iMac, iMac Pro, MacBook Pro and Mac mini are not legitimate replacements to the Mac Pro, even compared to the base configuration. The Mac Pro has expandability and much MUCH better thermals.

much MUCH better thermals - That remains to be seen - remember the overheating issues of the trash can?
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Apple is banking its GPU future on Metal. And Nvidia refuses to support Metal on their GPU's. That's why you'll never see their GPU on Macs.

One question I'd like to ask - since when did AMD get better ? the 2011 MacBook Pros were bad because AMD sucked and still does suck.. I will be surprised if anything AMD breaks given the history with the 2011 MacBook pros ?

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

I have 2 favorite jokes about this.

#1, I'd rather concentrate on the home and buying a car first, about the same cost.

#2 If Apple as rumored switches to A Series AIM chips in the next couple years, the value of these will plummet to one SIXTH their cost almost immediately. Anyone remember the PowerMac G5 Megahertz myth Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field keynotes? PowerMac G5 computers could still be powerful today if anything was ever written for PowerPC again. I just won't be had by Apple again like that.

 

[Macbookprodude]

You're talking about prices and capability. And the Iici and IIfx were the best Apple had to offer back then in terms of power and expandability.

Today's Mac Pro and Pro Display HDR are well priced.

I flatly disagree - who wants to pay 4000 and 1000 on top for a monitor ?? I am sorry, but your logic is FLAWED - Mac Pro, not so because 99 percent of people in USA don't need this machine..The only reason why I have a 2010-2012 Mac Pro is for expandability and tinkering.
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Yearly sales of Macs in general is a little under 20M, the vast majority of which are laptops.

If they update the Mac Pro in late 2021 and have sold a million of them before the 2019 is discontinued I’ll be surprised. But that’s nothing to do with the machine being “over priced” - the vast majority of computing needs for Mac users are met by the lower tier products.

Mac Pro is niche - I expect less than 2 percent maybe 1 percent where this machine will sell.

 

[HiRez]

I was excited to see an update but at 5k starting price point, which more than average Joe, can afford this except for the very wealthy and professionals who would buy this equipment though their businesses. It is sad but never the less a great product they can be proud of at Apple.

Actually starts at 6K. I certainly can't afford a maxed out model, but I'd be really tempted by the base 8 core if it were closer to $4K. So even though, yes, these will largely be sold to institutions with large budgets, I do think they are missing out on some lower-end sales by making the base price so high.

I bought the original dual G5 cheese grater, a badass machine at the time, and it served me well for many years. It started at $2,000 at the time (I actually had the 2x2.0 GHz model), which is about $2,700 in inflation-adjusted 2019 money. That means the base Mac Pro now costs more than twice as much in real money as it did in 2003, the barrier to entry is much, much higher. That's a shame.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

PowerMac G5 computers could still be powerful today if anything was ever written for PowerPC again.

That IS a funny joke!

 

[Macbookprodude]

I was going to get a Mac Pro $6000 unit it is worth every penny, when people talk about building their own computer they only look at the processor, or storage or memory. What is the real meat and potatoes is the bus speed and backplane speeds. And apple engineers the heck out of the underling structure. So you might get parts and slap in on a motherboard, the motherboard will never have the speed of the Mac Pro.

I decided to go with a MacBook Pro 16 with 32 gigs of ram, 2TB of storage, which I split for Bootcamp for Windows 10 and the AMD 5500 with 8GB of ram. Got a Razer Core X to use my Vega 64 card that ran in my old Mac Pro before it died. And The whole setup was like $3600 dollars. The nice think about the MacBook Pro it is portable and I can take it to work vs sitting at home not being used. So instead of keep a Mac Pro for 10 years, and upgrading, I decided to get a MacBook Pro and upgrade ever 5 years, so I will get upgraded technology. But still having the option to upgrade the video card in a year or 2 maybe even twice.

This MacBook Pro 16 is awesome and worth every penny. If you are looking for a desktop, that is expandable, tell Apple, I want a Mac mini pro with this kinds of things and feed back to Apple. Apple might grant you your wish next year, That is why you need to use Apple Feedback page to tell them what you want.

Technology has a limited life span so the more time it is not being used, the less value per dollar spent the equipment.

Well maybe when I retire in 10 years I will get a 2030 Mac Pro tower work out of the house from

Yeah, but the 16 inch MacBook Pro is not upgradable.. you can't upgrade the SSD, memory, etc.. because DIY upgrades is long gone now, so in 5 years when you want to expand your machine, it will be a paper weight.. This is why I kinda don't like America because they think about material things.. in Ukraine most of us are starving and no food. Because I work as security in the Ukrainian gov't which pays me nicely, I can afford such things, but average Ukrainians and I also believe most Americans can't afford 6000 for a computer.
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That IS a funny joke!

He has a point. If back then PPC used altivec in all their apps, then yes.

 

[Onelifenofear]

Because many pros actually can’t afford or justify $12,000. Even if you are pro, you still have a budget.
And when you look at what performance you could get for maybe $4-5,000 Linux machine with 32 cores and multiple high end GPU’s, the $12,000 is just going to be a hard sell for people in my field, which uses little to no Mac-specific software.

Linux is great.. but runs nothing useful for a lot of pro graphics guys.

I bought an silicon graphics onyx workstation back in the day for I think 45k

I bought a reference monitor second hand for 18k A

my tree guy just bought a work van for 30k. His pro tools are another 20+

Tools are tools. You figure them into your cost or you are not pro. That’s basically it. A lawyer charges 300 an hour cos the offices are 200k a year.

This is actually peanuts for what it is. And remember. You are paying for Apple service. I’ve had a replacement iMac pro in 2 hours with Apple business. Try that with dell or anyone else. Even build you own you’d be hard pushed to get you own machine fixed in 24 hours if something went wrong.

 

[jinnyman]

You know, as for XDR, nothing like is on the market, but then, without whatever like XDR, everyone is creating professional content just fine even now. Of course, better is better, but then, why go too much if Eizo or professional ultra fine by Dell is enough to create contents already? it's more than half cost (and of course, with stand).

Same with Mac Pro. If your business was able to handle business with old MP by now, you really don't need raw performance provided by 7,1 so it comes down to the firm's marketing. Showing off the shiny instrument to customers are also important. I give that. But all the horse power work is usually outsourced anyway, and trust me, many Mac only business will not just simply swap all their gear with MP 7,1. Most will keep using iMac Pro. If your business really depends on raw power, friend, you already moved to other platform.

So my conclusion is this : Apple is not really caring for those who need, but rather those with money who want the most trendy apple device.

 

[beaker7]

. I’ve had a replacement iMac pro in 2 hours with Apple business. Try that with dell or anyone else. Even build you own you’d be hard pushed to get you own machine fixed in 24 hours if something went wrong.

Dell ProSupport Onsite not available where you are? They show up within 4 hours with parts. 5 year coverage.

 

[jinnyman]

Linux is great.. but runs nothing useful for a lot of pro graphics guys.

I bought an silicon graphics onyx workstation back in the day for I think 45k

I bought a reference monitor second hand for 18k A

my tree guy just bought a work van for 30k. His pro tools are another 20+

Tools are tools. You figure them into your cost or you are not pro. That’s basically it. A lawyer charges 300 an hour cos the offices are 200k a year.

This is actually peanuts for what it is. And remember. You are paying for Apple service. I’ve had a replacement iMac pro in 2 hours with Apple business. Try that with dell or anyone else. Even build you own you’d be hard pushed to get you own machine fixed in 24 hours if something went wrong.

Yes back in the day when whatever tool was the only tool available then i get it. Other than running Mac OS, Mac Pro internals are nothing special about it. The instruction set is same instruction set run by Intel and AMD. No matter how special Apple is marketing it as, it's same workstation level computer that everyone else is selling. So the question you have to ask is this : Apple tax from going MP 7,1 justified? If so, go for it.

As for the business service, no I disagree. In fact, dell business service is much better. Can you extend Apple service period however you like? coverage? parts swap? Don't tell me you have to send your device in. And i don't believe your story. Nobody can swap in 2 hours unless you are living next to Apple store or service provider.

 

[falainber]

I just speced out a Dual Xeon 8180 from Dell and it was $31,000 with only 64gb ram and 256 GB SSD

Yes, they are not cheap. The good thing about Dell is that they offer desktop workstations from $800 to $100+K.

 

[cmaier]

Linux is great.. but runs nothing useful for a lot of pro graphics guys.

I bought an silicon graphics onyx workstation back in the day for I think 45k

I bought a reference monitor second hand for 18k A

my tree guy just bought a work van for 30k. His pro tools are another 20+

Tools are tools. You figure them into your cost or you are not pro. That’s basically it. A lawyer charges 300 an hour cos the offices are 200k a year.

This is actually peanuts for what it is. And remember. You are paying for Apple service. I’ve had a replacement iMac pro in 2 hours with Apple business. Try that with dell or anyone else. Even build you own you’d be hard pushed to get you own machine fixed in 24 hours if something went wrong.

Cheap lawyer.

 

[Macbookprodude]

I alway say if you want something from Apple you got to use the Apple feedback page. If you want a Mac Mini Pro, you got to ask for it. People did not like the MacBook Pro keyboard, they fixed it, People wanted better cooling for the MacBook Pro and they did it. They wanted a bigger screen, like the old 17in MacBook Pro and they did it. The AMD 5500 mobile chip is fantastic, i am running borderlands 3 at 70fps.

The new Macbook Pro 16 is a killer laptop. If my job required it I would get a new Mac Pro to do the job without a question.

If the AMD chips in the 2011 MacBook pros were bad, what makes you think they will suck in the new stuff ?

 

[jinnyman]

Yes, they are not cheap. The good thing about Dell is that they offer desktop workstations from $800 to $100+K.

Also, Xeon Platinum 8180 price is from the era where Intel could charge whatever they desire to charge for their CPU. It's price is out of sane field for 2019 standard.

CPU war is on going, and spending previous Intel cost is no longer a wise decision.
MP 7,1 is a single CPU workstation where there are so many competitive CPU choices. If Apple were to introduce MP 7,1 with more than 2 physical CPUs, then they could have put whatever margin they wanted. But no.

 

[Stephen.R]

Well parallel performance is what I buy a multi-core workstation for.
But I know that there are many usage cases for mac pros.

Or, you know, most tasks can benefit somewhat from parallel/multi core processing to a degree, but it often has diminishing returns as core count increases.

I mean really? Your suggestion is that people buy a Mac Pro to browse the web? Ok sure. You believe that buddy.

Be honest, is that NOT what you meant when asking me to show you where?

No I didn’t expect screenshots.

I just figured that if you saw people making a claim enough to remember it you might also remember where they made it. Even a vague reference would have been fine

Then you responded back asking me to show them to you, implying you didn't believe me. Maybe that's why I'm being so defensive.

If someone tells me they heard someone else say something, but when I ask who, or where, or just for any kind of context they don’t know, and get defensive about it, I tend not to give their opinion much weight.

Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal, and third hand anecdotal evidence is about as reliable as a snowman in the desert.

dream on The pro and those mpx modules wont get an update for ages, if ever. We dont even know if there will be ever a next mac pro.

Because seeing how the “pro” market reacted to the lack of updates to the 2013 Mac Pro, apple is very eager to repeat that, as opposed to pushing out incremental updates as they did with the original Mac pro towers in 2006, 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2012, I suppose?

 

[throAU]

Being beaten by 60% at launch by a $2000 processor feels ‘obliterated’ to me, but hey, potato potahto. View attachment 881600

Yeah, thats cinebench though.

But yes, we're arguing semantics at this point, and again.... in q1, 2020 AMD performance is going to almost double with the 48 and 64 core 3980X and 3990X due for release.

Intel truly have nothing, the 28 core W-3275 was a last ditch effort to compete and they're in short supply.

Linux is great.. but runs nothing useful for a lot of pro graphics guys.

It's the platform of choice for Blender, which is occasionally used by a bunch of "pro graphcs guys" for film and TV making (i.e., the exact market the Mac Pro is targeted at). Blender also got a major update with improved UI and performance with 2.80.

https://www.unixmen.com/commercial-a-movies-built-in-blender/
(old list from 2011, but most of the new lists are in youtube video format and i'm at work)

Blender on a 3990X Linux box would be a much cheaper alternative than a Mac Pro for a lot of guys, with much better performance in most stuff as well.

 

[smulji]

What would you do with it in a rack-mount server setting? macOS Server is a joke!

Great question for Apple. When they announced it, they specifically said you can buy it in rack mount configuration.