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PinkyMacGodess

Suspended
Mar 7, 2007
10,271
6,226
Midwest America.
But that's it. We ALL pay for their 'dirty habit'. Plus the tobacco industry is heavily tax payer funded too, so in reality, like high fructose corn syrup, the tax payer pays for it at ever step. So if the tobacco companies didn't get tax payer funding, and government help to market their 'dirty habit', it wouldn't be as much of a deal, but WE pay them, we pay for the marketing, we pay for the health issues, and we pay for the lost work hours, and we pay for the environmental problems all those butts and packaging cause.

Looking at smoking in totality, it's a VERY high social/financial cost 'dirty habit'. If the subsidies ended, the tobacco companies would go bankrupt, or move to some nasty cheap labor country. Just on health costs alone, ending smoking would offset the lose of the industry. Smoking is selfish...

And I did smoke. In high school. I succumbed to the need to look cool, and be a rebel. The largest driver was my parents, who both smoked multiple packs a day. All of us kids in that house stole packs from them. While my mother was on her death bed from metastasizing lung cancer from a life time of smoking (she said she started at age 7), she knew we were stealing packs, and said nothing about it because she started smoking so young. I'd like to smack the **** out of her for that, but hindsight. I noticed my skin changing, and other health changes, and most of which the loss of the ability to run, and ride my bike like I used to in elementary school. I quit. I dropped it like a rock. I never touched it again, until college when a prof used to smoke in his office. I found myself sitting there, fumigating, and feeling like I was back at home, but then started finding ways to not stop at his office. He was my advisor for a few years. AWKWARD... Smoking is disgusting. It's the only product, so far, that has the intended consequences of killing the user. The companies have spent decades developing a more addictive cigarette. They WANT people to be addicted. And they will do everything they can to make sure people get that way. Candy 'cigarettes'? I remember those. 'Joe Camel', and his cartoons? Yeah, get 'em hooked young...

And tax payers largely support the industry. Same with the oil conglomerates, and so many other industries.

We are 'born to shop', and expected to be obedient consumers. No questions, no push back. And the pharmaceutical industry is almost as bad. 'Born to shop'...
 
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russell_314

macrumors 603
Feb 10, 2019
6,046
9,010
USA
The virus doesn’t care about politics. Or age.

It is partial to ignorance through as a 30 year San Antonia man found found out Friday - a week after attending a “Covid” party he was dead. Cause: Covid.
You’re right the virus does not care about politics but there is a big difference when it comes to age. When I said there’s politics involved I mean how the media reports the virus. They blame Trump rallies for spreading the virus while pretending that protest with tens of thousands of people are safe and had no effect. It’s really hard to separate what the media is using this virus for political purposes versus what is really true about it.
 

TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2017
4,205
8,838
You’re right the virus does not care about politics but there is a big difference when it comes to age. When I said there’s politics involved I mean how the media reports the virus. They blame Trump rallies for spreading the virus while pretending that protest with tens of thousands of people are safe and had no effect. It’s really hard to separate what the media is using this virus for political purposes versus what is really true about it.

I read much of the MSM and, whilst I see them talking about rally’s being a potential infection point, most stories seem to revolve around idiots going to bars, having parties, at the beach etc.
 

russell_314

macrumors 603
Feb 10, 2019
6,046
9,010
USA
I read much of the MSM and, whilst I see them talking about rally’s being a potential infection point, most stories seem to revolve around idiots going to bars, having parties, at the beach etc.
Exactly they talk about people going to bars and parties but pretend that these protests are happening in a vacuum. Don't get me wrong going to a bar is totally stupid but lets not pretend that this spike in cases that happened a few weeks after the protests has nothing to do with them.
 

PinkyMacGodess

Suspended
Mar 7, 2007
10,271
6,226
Midwest America.
Exactly they talk about people going to bars and parties but pretend that these protests are happening in a vacuum. Don't get me wrong going to a bar is totally stupid but lets not pretend that this spike in cases that happened a few weeks after the protests has nothing to do with them.

Okay, but what does it matter? The rallies are prime spreading opportunities too, and trump keeps having them.

We are so screwed in this country. New York did it right, after a while. New Zealand has ZERO cases now. Trump's America hs more cases than the top, how many countries COMBINED? America is a tragic story about the dysfunction and abject failure of 'populism'. You can't have your own facts. Science is the law. It's damned sad that the idiot class has taken over the country. Die if you want, but don't try to tell people you are 'prolife', or even value life. Nothing about this massive body count shows ANY value of human life at all. Especially sine so many countries have done so much better.

It's beyond tragic.
 
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Hieveryone

macrumors 603
Apr 11, 2014
5,624
2,337
USA
I read much of the MSM and, whilst I see them talking about rally’s being a potential infection point, most stories seem to revolve around idiots going to bars, having parties, at the beach etc.

Well when there's about 325,200,000 Americans who have NOT tested positive for the virus...

There's plenty who will go to bars, weddings, Disney World, etc

They are open after all...

As long as your following the local rules then I think it should be up to the individual what they want to do. Asking your healthcare provider about your personal situation might be a good idea as well

But it's not like young folks are going to listen to anyone anyway lol
 
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TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2017
4,205
8,838
Well when there's about 325,200,000 Americans who have NOT tested positive for the virus...

There's plenty who will go to bars, weddings, Disney World, etc

They are open after all...

As long as your following the local rules then I think it should be up to the individual what they want to do. Asking your healthcare provider about your personal situation might be a good idea as well

But it's not like young folks are going to listen to anyone anyway lol
The problem isn’t your health.

You could get COVID and be asymptomatic. You cough once, you use your hand to cover your mouth.

Then you go to a grocery store, gas station, or other place, spreading the virus as you go.

People go to the same places. Someone touches the same door.

Or you sneeze as you walk past someone, spreading droplets everywhere.

That someone also becomes COVID-19 positive. A week later they’re dead.

Harsh? Sure. But oh so real.

This is not about you. This is about everyone else.
 

BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
9,832
14,028
Well when there's about 325,200,000 Americans who have NOT tested positive for the virus...

There's plenty who will go to bars, weddings, Disney World, etc

They are open after all...

As long as your following the local rules then I think it should be up to the individual what they want to do. Asking your healthcare provider about your personal situation might be a good idea as well

But it's not like young folks are going to listen to anyone anyway lol

Well, just because there’s 325 million Americans not positive doesn’t mean it won’t take much for quite a few more to become positive...

There are many things that you CAN do that reasonable minded people know not to do after all...

Following local rules has the virus soaring. States are closing down again. California, where I live, just shut down gyms, bars, restaurants, churches, indoor gatherings of any kind ... after opening up for less than a month ... because people aren’t taking the virus seriously and spreading it faster than ever before.

Yeah, they aren’t - because of people’s ignorance and stupidity we’re back in a closed down state. When everything is shut down again these people will have themselves to thank.

How many more people have to die before people get it? I guess those who aren’t taking this seriously want **** to be closed down for a very very long time.
 

Hieveryone

macrumors 603
Apr 11, 2014
5,624
2,337
USA
The problem isn’t your health.

You could get COVID and be asymptomatic. You cough once, you use your hand to cover your mouth.

Then you go to a grocery store, gas station, or other place, spreading the virus as you go.

People go to the same places. Someone touches the same door.

Or you sneeze as you walk past someone, spreading droplets everywhere.

That someone also becomes COVID-19 positive. A week later they’re dead.

Harsh? Sure. But oh so real.

This is not about you. This is about everyone else.

Well then those people who are "at risk" should just stay at home? I don't think the people going to the bars are exactly 100 years old lol
 

BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
9,832
14,028
Well then those people who are "at risk" should just stay at home? I don't think the people going to the bars are exactly 100 years old lol

You’ve been reading Tiggr’s posts right? The virus just isn’t hitting old people anymore. There are a lot of 20-40 year olds getting hit, more than ever before. A lot of people who are “at risk” are staying home, yet the virus numbers are growing and death rates are growing - significantly - kids at bars are infecting each other and it is resulting in deaths.

That’s why they’re closing everything down again.
 
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PinkyMacGodess

Suspended
Mar 7, 2007
10,271
6,226
Midwest America.
You’ve been reading Tiggr’s posts right? The virus just isn’t hitting old people anymore. There are a lot of 20-40 year olds getting hit, more than ever before. A lot of people who are “at risk” are staying home, yet the virus numbers are growing and death rates are growing - significantly - kids at bars are infecting each other and it is resulting in deaths.

That’s why they’re closing everything down again.

An 11 year-old died just last week. A 30-something died here a few weeks ago. Came into hospital with cough, and within a few days, was dead.

And it's not the death that is the worst part of this. It's the lingering side effects. Some people never recover their sense of smell, some never recover their prior lung capacity, some never walk again because their legs were amputated due to clots, and some are vegetables who have zero chance of ever having a life again because of strokes. This virus is hitting the body in many various ways, so to assume that someone is going to 'survive' it, is assuming that they 100% recover. Far too many have NOT recovered. Far too many are dead. Many wish they were dead. Just over the weekend was the story of a guy that went to a 'COVID party' and came down with it, and his last words were that he thought he'd made a 'big mistake'. He was dead by the next day.

Sure, assume you aren't going to get it. Assume that you will be the 'lucky ones' that survive this. Assume a lot, but if you do get it, assume that you are going to cost the system a butt load of money, and eventually, you will be cutoff, and set adrift.

I've known three people who have died from this. The president seems to be allowing this to rage across the country for some reason. Probably so he can stop the elections from happening. I don't want to die, or be permanently sickened for that bloated mass to stay in office. The tax cuts have been nice, but it's not worth it. It's damn sick that people are backing him, and applying the 'pro-life' sticker on him, and themselves. There is NOTHING pro-life about what's happening now. Nothing...

New Zealand is at zero cases. America has more cases than the next x-number of countries added together! I think it's Texas has enough cases, that if they were an actual country, they would be number 4 in the world.

People are being encouraged to risk their lives with this. Something is going to happen, and we all need to be prepared for it when it does. You just don't encourage your entire population to expose themselves to a horrible pandemic and play cards. The future of our country is at stake. Getting sick is playing into his hands.

Wear a damn mask. Stay the hell home when you don't have to go out. Don't take unnecessary risks. Be healthy when this country falls to the ground so you can fight for it.
 

Gregg2

macrumors 604
May 22, 2008
7,203
1,188
Milwaukee, WI
You’re right the virus does not care about politics but there is a big difference when it comes to age. When I said there’s politics involved I mean how the media reports the virus. They blame Trump rallies for spreading the virus while pretending that protest with tens of thousands of people are safe and had no effect. It’s really hard to separate what the media is using this virus for political purposes versus what is really true about it.
I would say that's selective consumption of media reports. I have seen/heard reports about the danger posed from all large gatherings, including the protest marches.
 

Hieveryone

macrumors 603
Apr 11, 2014
5,624
2,337
USA
You’ve been reading Tiggr’s posts right? The virus just isn’t hitting old people anymore. There are a lot of 20-40 year olds getting hit, more than ever before. A lot of people who are “at risk” are staying home, yet the virus numbers are growing and death rates are growing - significantly - kids at bars are infecting each other and it is resulting in deaths.

That’s why they’re closing everything down again.

Where I am things are open. I don't think the reports in the media, albeit sad, are going to stop many millions of Americans. Hasn't so far... ?‍♂️
 

The-Real-Deal82

macrumors P6
Jan 17, 2013
16,546
24,310
Wales, United Kingdom
Where I am things are open. I don't think the reports in the media, albeit sad, are going to stop many millions of Americans. Hasn't so far...

We as a species are very selfish and often stupid though. Opening beaches in my country and now pubs hasn’t stopped people packing them out. I just hope it’s those people who end up dying and not people who have been careful and accidentally touched something contaminated by these selfish morons. I’m fine with people as a collective taking the risk if enjoying a drink in a pub is more important than anything else. I just don’t want another lockdown with tens of thousands dying and massive job losses. It’s about time people educated themselves and thought about the bigger picture.
 
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C DM

macrumors Sandy Bridge
Oct 17, 2011
51,392
19,459
Where I am things are open. I don't think the reports in the media, albeit sad, are going to stop many millions of Americans. Hasn't so far... ?‍♂️
Seems like pretty much all of that has already been fairly thoroughly and repeatedly discussed and addressed in another thread (which ended up getting closed for going around in the same circles).
 
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Hieveryone

macrumors 603
Apr 11, 2014
5,624
2,337
USA
Yes it has. There’s a ton of places shut down or with limited access.

Take your blinders off...

You would never know it, as there is a heck of a lot more open than closed (including Disney World which I’m going)
 
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ruka.snow

macrumors 68000
Jun 6, 2017
1,886
5,182
Scotland
I don't think people are taking this thing seriously.

At the supermarket yesterday, the two women in front of me didn't have masks, and the two women behind me wouldn't keep a reasonable distance. And roughly half the people at the post-office did not have face masks. (Both the supermarket and post-office had signs requiring face masks).

Some people can not wear a mask. I am exempt but I still tired it and then quickly worked out why my doctor said no. I had to puff my inhaler for a wee while afterwards and felt like I was dying. I am not saying they have the same problem, but please remember that those that are wearing masks is often to protect people that can't and that will be even more affected by this virus. We still need to get our groceries in.
 

Hieveryone

macrumors 603
Apr 11, 2014
5,624
2,337
USA
Some people can not wear a mask. I am exempt but I still tired it and then quickly worked out why my doctor said no. I had to puff my inhaler for a wee while afterwards and felt like I was dying. I am not saying they have the same problem, but please remember that those that are wearing masks is often to protect people that can't and that will be even more affected by this virus. We still need to get our groceries in.

This.

There’s people who don’t wear masks for medical reasons. There’s people who may not even know They have a medical condition but actually may have one, and therefore don’t like the mask bc it makes it harder to breathe.

Point is, we shouldn’t judge people
 

BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
9,832
14,028
This.

There’s people who don’t wear masks for medical reasons. There’s people who may not even know They have a medical condition but actually may have one, and therefore don’t like the mask bc it makes it harder to breathe.

Point is, we shouldn’t judge people

If I take your $ out of your bank because I needed it and your car/phone because I badly need one does that mean you won’t judge me?

While I do agree that people are overly judgmental there is a reason for the seriousness in this thread. Lives are at stake.

One has to be willfully ignorant of current events not to see the second wave / shutdowns happening again. Ignorance is indeed bliss for some in this thread.

Look, I want things to return to normal just as much as the next person, but pretending this virus doesn’t exist is going to make things worse. Much much worse. People who are willfully ignorant not only cause more death but they keep things closed longer.
 

nebo1ss

macrumors 68030
Jun 2, 2010
2,906
1,696
You’re right the virus does not care about politics but there is a big difference when it comes to age. When I said there’s politics involved I mean how the media reports the virus. They blame Trump rallies for spreading the virus while pretending that protest with tens of thousands of people are safe and had no effect. It’s really hard to separate what the media is using this virus for political purposes versus what is really true about it.
They are both bad ideas. However, at least the protest is outdoors and probably less harmful than indoor rallies.
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This.

There’s people who don’t wear masks for medical reasons. There’s people who may not even know They have a medical condition but actually may have one, and therefore don’t like the mask bc it makes it harder to breathe.

Point is, we shouldn’t judge people
Have you tried on a mask. There is no problem breathing with them on. The only issue i have is that it sometimes causes my glasses to fog up.
 
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