Don't forget... Windows 10 is still Windows!

[Queen6]

I'm going to check out that Autoruns software as I've never heard of that one. Sounds very useful.

I just built a Windows 10 gaming rig the other week which now sits next to my Arch Linux daily driver PC. With the hardware power I built into it, I'm not all that worried about Windows getting sluggish, but at the same time, I don't like the notion of things eating up RAM and CPU cycles needlessly. That's just me being picky (not quite OCD).

With a Ryzen 7 3800x, 32 GB RAM and 1.5 TB of SSD storage and a GeForce RTX 2070, this machine purrs along nicely.

The only stuff I installed is Steam, Origin and the Nvidia Experience along with Firefox. That's really about the biggest applications I put on it.

On my Arch box, I don't worry about anything like I might with my Windows box. I built the hardware and the OS and put all the packages I wanted on it from scratch. I love Linux so much!

But, I'm going to look at the Autoruns software later today for my gaming rig.

Autoruns and Process Explorer are invaluable tool's you can also link them to the Virus Total. I use Autoruns to limit 3rd part applications & service starting on booting. If the same application's are needed their associated services will still start only on demand.

For the most part just need to turn on storage sense and W10 will clean any tmp files etc. automatically. Think a lot of folk are still relating to the Windows of old, I don't see slow downs or the system images growing due to junk.

MS is simply conservative, W10 tends to hold on to data and the OS will consolidate periodically such as updates. Windows is far from perfect, equally MS is doing a reasonably decent job given the footprint and demands on the OS.

All OS have both positives and negatives; one of my old 15" MBP's recently returned as it was dead slow and ultimately failed to run, equally that was on multiple users over the years installing what ever, not the fault of the OS. Same story with an old ThinkPad, time on the hands and all.

Been looking at Linux, alstough not a specific distro I've always had an interest in KDE Neon, might be a good time to revisit the Linux distros and see how things have moved along. KDE I like the visual simplicity, yet the deep customisation and the options of the underlying kernel.

Q-6

 

[maflynn]

Do you still have the Lenovo?

Yes, I was going to sell it, but I never got around to it, which was a blessing in disguise, as we are all trapped. Both of my kids needed to use computers, so they're using my spares.

Also, what antivirus / antimalware do you use on your machines? Windows Defender Or third party? If third party, which one.

I had used malwarebytes, and AVG, but I'm only using Defender at this point

 

[Queen6]

Yes, I was going to sell it, but I never got around to it, which was a blessing in disguise, as we are all trapped. Both of my kids needed to use computers, so they're using my spares.


I had used malwarebytes, and AVG, but I'm only using Defender at this point

MS Defender, backed up with on demand only scanners from Emsisoft & Kaspersky. Autoruns & Process Explorer linked to Virus Total's DB. The on demand scanner I just run infrequently as verification.

Q-6

 

[maflynn]

MS Defender, backed up with on demand

I'm pretty happy with MS Defender, malwarebytes offered another level of protection but overall given my usage habits, I'm rather low risk. I also have my networked running a pi-hole, so it blocks a number of sites that could compromise my system.

My of my data is backed up on OneDrive, so I could wipe my system and not lose anything that I don't want to lose

 

[SandboxGeneral]

Been looking at Linux, alstough not a specific distro I've always had an interest in KDE Neon, might be a good time to revisit the Linux distros and see how things have moved along. KDE I like the visual simplicity, yet the deep customisation and the options of the underlying kernel.

I used KDE Neon for almost 2 years at work. It is a very good distro with lots of GUI customization options available.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

Yes, I was going to sell it, but I never got around to it, which was a blessing in disguise, as we are all trapped. Both of my kids needed to use computers, so they're using my spares.


I had used malwarebytes, and AVG, but I'm only using Defender at this point

MS Defender, backed up with on demand only scanners from Emsisoft & Kaspersky. Autoruns & Process Explorer linked to Virus Total's DB. The on demand scanner I just run infrequently as verification.

Q-6

I'm pretty happy with MS Defender, malwarebytes offered another level of protection but overall given my usage habits, I'm rather low risk. I also have my networked running a pi-hole, so it blocks a number of sites that could compromise my system.

My of my data is backed up on OneDrive, so I could wipe my system and not lose anything that I don't want to lose

I have been using MS Defender, and nothing else. I am thinking of adding another solution to the mix, but I’m leary of killing performance. Ive been using third party solutions since my DOS days, and running without a third party solution makes me feel vulnerable with Windows.

 

[Queen6]

I have been using MS Defender, and nothing else. I am thinking of adding another solution to the mix, but I’m leary of killing performance. Ive been using third party solutions since my DOS days, and running without a third party solution makes me feel vulnerable with Windows.

Emsisoft is installed and manually updated within it's own GUI, however does not run any background processes being a solely an on demand AV scanner. Kaspersky does not install, is a standalone executable file only and needs to downloaded on each use.

Neither will impact the system other than space usage as they do not run or auto start unless the user wants.

Individual files (less then 128Mb I think) can be verified by Virus Totals web interface with no installation, use full although rather limited. Better solution is to link MS Sysinternal Autoruns & Process Explorer to Virus Total and create shortcut to the apps in the Start Menu. If installing Emsisoft you will also need to manually create a Start Menu shortcut if you want to run from the Start Menu or you can just execute the file directly.

n.b. Command Line is for advanced users, equally just needs some reading

All can executed directly, for convenience & completeness I opt to create the short cuts in Start, with Autoruns & Process Explorer moved to Program Files (no installer) and Emsisoft installed in the Root of the System drive (EEK)

Note Autoruns & Process Explorer do not auto update nor frequently update, I check 2-3 a year and replace the executable files as needed. By default these applications all run in isolation without impacting the system. When dealing with Virus Total's DB it's driven by 70+ AV engines so be mindful of false positives and don't immediately reach for the DEL key 🙂

Q-6

 

[Queen6]

I used KDE Neon for almost 2 years at work. It is a very good distro with lots of GUI customization options available.

I like KDE a lot, however my current hardware doesn't lend to Linux overly, although this primary Asus is getting closer. I also like that there are underlying version of Plasma up to an including Arch. I would still need to run W10 for the time being so tend to focus on the OS. Mac is out the picture professionally although I maintain a few for personal use, mostly HTPC an old email repository and the infamous 2011 15" for no other reason than it entertains me to do so

Q-6

 

[DCIFRTHS]

Emsisoft is installed and manually updated within it's own GUI, however does not run any background processes being a solely an on demand AV scanner. Kaspersky does not install, is a standalone executable file only and needs to downloaded on each use.

Neither will impact the system other than space usage as they do not run or auto start unless the user wants.

Individual files (less then 128Mb I think) can be verified by Virus Totals web interface with no installation, use full although rather limited. Better solution is to link MS Sysinternal Autoruns & Process Explorer to Virus Total and create shortcut to the apps in the Start Menu. If installing Emsisoft you will also need to manually create a Start Menu shortcut if you want to run from the Start Menu or you can just execute the file directly.

View attachment 904458

View attachment 904461
n.b. Command Line is for advanced users, equally just needs some reading

All can executed directly, for convenience & completeness I opt to create the short cuts in Start, with Autoruns & Process Explorer moved to Program Files (no installer) and Emsisoft installed in the Root of the System drive (EEK)

Note Autoruns & Process Explorer do not auto update nor frequently update, I check 2-3 a year and replace the executable files as needed. By default these applications all run in isolation without impacting the system. When dealing with Virus Total's DB it's driven by 70+ AV engines so be mindful of false positives and don't immediately reach for the DEL key 🙂

Q-6

Thanks for the detailed information!

 

[Queen6]

Thanks for the detailed information!

Need more let me know, isn't easy to switch OS if I can't help I will, if not one of the other members will...

Q-6

 

[DCIFRTHS]

Need more let me know, isn't easy to switch OS if I can't help I will, if not one of the other members will...

Q-6

That’s very nice of you, and I appreciate the offer

 

[throAU]

Actually, modern Linux distros support ACL.

Support != actually used
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Signature check on linux for executables isn't needed in linux. Linux uses repositories that are pre checked.

Yes it is, and this is why Microsoft are working on Linux patches to enable this feature. It is a deficiency in linux at the moment.

It doesn't matter if your repo uses sigs, that doesn't stop malware (or other software loaded outside the repo) being uploaded into your machine and executing.

I'm not sure you understand how code signing works.

 

[mick2]

Support != actually used

Also worth noting selinux (and apparmor) here; I use Fedora as my daily driver and this comes with selinux baked in and enabled by default.

Selinux confines system procs, apps and other services (eg Network) at a far more granular level than anything I'm aware of in either Win10 or MacOS. It's also resonably good at getting out of the way with typical day to day use.

 

[c0ppo]

Support != actually used

Ok

Yes it is, and this is why Microsoft are working on Linux patches to enable this feature. It is a deficiency in linux at the moment.

Hunting down software + drivers via web browser you choose to ignore I see.
Also, while installing software, a lot of times that software pushes other installs as well. Like cleaners and similar nonsense.

I'm not sure you understand how code signing works.

Indeed

Anyway, I'm done here. No point in this silly debate anymore. Best regards

 

[maflynn]

while installing software, a lot of times that software pushes other installs as well. Like cleaners and similar nonsense.

Things have gotten better in the windows world regarding this, but many publishers do piggyback bloatware onto their installs. I have to be vigilant when doing an install.

 

[c0ppo]

Things have gotten better in the windows world regarding this, but many publishers do piggyback bloatware onto their installs. I have to be vigilant when doing an install.

Just a few days ago I had to uninstall Avast from my wife X1C. She says she never installed any AV, and she doesn't even know what AV stands for. My guess is she installed it during some other installs.

 

[AndyMacAndMic]

Just a few days ago I had to uninstall Avast from my wife X1C. She says she never installed any AV, and she doesn't even know what AV stands for. My guess is she installed it during some other installs.

Things have gotten better != Things don't happen anymore

 

[Queen6]

Things have gotten better in the windows world regarding this, but many publishers do piggyback bloatware onto their installs. I have to be vigilant when doing an install.

Agree as the bloat is just turning people off full stop. My feedback to such publishers is to cease and desist as I won't use or positively comment if PUP is included in the DL package.

I also see the flip side of the coin as many budget manufacturers would not be able to offer reasonably fluid hardware at such low price points without such paid support. The answer is clear; remove the bloat or do a clean install of W10, you won't regret either ways.

Those with issue, only need to ask as undoubtedly a member will have solution or direction. I wonder at times; was it the Mac or the people on the Mac...

Q-6

 

[aevan]

Apple is increasingly limiting user control with macOS as it continues to dumb down the OS for it's own purpose.

Look, you keep saying that and I’ve heard that before in the phone world (but Apple is so “closed, limiting, dumbed down”), but the fact is, on my Mac, I do my work - which is Photoshop, Zbrush, Blender, Office stuff - I also have a lot of automation, great tools like BetterTouchTool, great time management tools - I mean, my work is pretty complex and I get it done on my Mac. In fact, a lot of tools work better on a Mac - especially automation.

I don’t know what kind of work you do, must be something really advanced, since my workflow is not exactly lightweight. But, at the end of the day, I can do everything for my job on my Mac with style (and yes, I also know how Windows works, what is possible and what not, because we use it a lot in the studio) - and I am yet to see an advantage in this “unlimiting world of Windows” you mention. In fact, I’ve consistently found better and more advanced tools for automation, design, productivity and organization on macOS.

Maybe you have a job where you need something specific Windows has to offer, maybe you are some software engineer, but I’m a pretty advanced user compared to most people - and still I don’t feel limited by macOS (quite the opposite) - AND my Macs work with less maintenance compared to Windows computers.

....and are more fun to use, I might add.

 

[xraydoc]

Agree as the bloat is just turning people off full stop. My feedback to such publishers is to cease and desist as I won't use or positively comment if PUP is included in the DL package.

I also see the flip side of the coin as many budget manufacturers would not be able to offer reasonably fluid hardware at such low price points without such paid support. The answer is clear; remove the bloat or do a clean install of W10, you won't regret either ways.

This is the truth. The race to the bottom has left the profit margins for most PC vendors so razor thin that they have to add paid bloatware just to make a few bucks. Apple has this advantage, as do a few "premium" PC vendors with generally higher price points.

Somewhat refreshingly, the only thing my new Dell came with that needed absolute immediate removal was the McAffee antivirus. And why in god's name does an antivirus require 1GB of space? But I digress. Yes, some Dell support software is installed, but I'm fine with that.

But beyond that, there's no excuse for a software application to include additional 3rd party utilities. If they do, I generally won't install that app on my machine. And I still only use applications from trusted publishers, or do my due diligence when using applications/utilities from smaller publishers.

Actually, the only piece of software that's behaving "Windows-y" is Citrix. The virtual screen driver has crapped out on me a couple times, leading to reboots while unattended (at least according to my interpretation of the log files). And if I didn't need it installed for my current work-from-home requirements, it wouldn't be installed at all. It'll get uninstalled ASAP as soon as quarantine is over. And while I've had Mac software leave my Mac in an unstable state as well, it still shouldn't be able to happen at all in 2020.

 

[LeeW]

So many Windows stability problems aren't actually Microsoft's fault directly - but caused by absolute total garbage drivers from third parties.

But the reality though is that the buck stops at Windows, so it is their fault ultimately. Microsoft should be doing more, as should Apple but they try at least which is a start.

 

[DarthVader!]

But the reality though is that the buck stops at Windows, so it is their fault ultimately

I'm not sure how you can blame MS for third party product quality.

 

[maflynn]

But the reality though is that the buck stops at Windows,

So is it Apple's fault that many Adobe products are slow and buggy on macOS or that Chrome is a bloated mess?

 

[GalileoSeven]

Someone else said it best when they said W10 is like macOS only without the hand holding - you have to know what/be smart about what you're downloading/installing.

For me personally, my desktop rig could use a thorough housecleaning, as I wasn't quite as discerning as I am now. On the other hand, through trial and error with it, I've learned what works for me when it comes to apps and system optimization and so forth.

So when I got this current laptop I'm on, I was a lot more careful. I downloaded Chrome (with uBlock Origin, Ghostery, LastPass and The Great Suspender add-ons), Steam, Avast AV and Malwarebytes. Then, I went in through the task manager and made sure only the absolute essentials were enabled on startup (Avast/Malwarebytes not making the cut).

I've only had this for 3 months, but so far, so good. Just have to be smart about it like I said.

 

[throAU]

But the reality though is that the buck stops at Windows, so it is their fault ultimately. Microsoft should be doing more, as should Apple but they try at least which is a start.

Agreed. But they're (Microsoft) between a rock and hard place. if they go total lockdown/signed drivers required/etc. (to eliminate the trash and fix the problem) then they end up just being a worse version of macOS due to the lack of compatibility and lack of cheap trashy hardware that is their "advantage" (i.e. why people who like/run windows can buy machines for so much cheaper and live with the problems).

They're trying - but they don't have the advantage Apple have of an ecosystem to lock people into, and full control of the hardware platform.