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MilaM

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2017
725
1,567
Laws are laws and rules are rules. Once you pass the Azores in the Atlantic, you’re no longer in the EU.
And contracts are contracts. My prediction is, that this grace period is one of the first things Apple has to backtrack on. The terms of service can't change, just because a EU user moves around the globe.
 
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Mother Nature

macrumors member
Sep 15, 2023
70
68
Colombia
Funny how Apple did and still does lots of things to hinder web apps in many ways. 🤷‍♂️

the reason they are doing it - though they probably never will admit it - to protect and bolster their golden goose app store income
Apple is a business, a company, not a charity.
 
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techfreak23

macrumors 6502a
Sep 8, 2013
682
830
That still doesn't address Apple's "security concerns" over an open paradigm on iOS when MacOS has just such an open paradigm, more specifically the "security concerns" Apple always throws up as why they don't want an open paradigm. I don't disagree with you on the business points at all, that's why I've happily given up my iPhone and iPad, only use my Mac as a server, and only am forced to mickey mouse iMessage because my family are still on iPhones. Once I can get my family off iPhones then the server can go.
I'm not fully with Apple on the security concerns rhetoric. Yes, there are risks, but not to the level that Apple is making it out to be. I left that out because Apple is going to say whatever it takes to help their case. My main point is that isn't the model Apple set out with for iOS and a governing body shouldn't be able to force a fundamental change in the platform.
 

TigerNike23

macrumors 6502a
Feb 13, 2017
849
2,051
Fort Myers, FL
A VPN bypasses that easily, although I have no idea if Google can use any hardware, app, or sign-in information from your device to further track you, or if that's even legal. But from what I understand many outside of the US do just that, use a VPN to be able to use country-specific content.

I'd be curious to see if a VPN had any utility in this situation, but I highly doubt it because of Apple's ability to monitor your hardware.
Software VPN doesn’t work. You need to create your own VPN, with a box (even a Raspberry Pi works) at the location to “check in” every 3 months.
 
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techfreak23

macrumors 6502a
Sep 8, 2013
682
830
Funny how Apple did and still does lots of things to hinder web apps in many ways. 🤷‍♂️

the reason they are doing it - though they probably never will admit it - to protect and bolster their golden goose app store income
True. And it is because they ended releasing an App Store that they stopped caring to better support web apps. Web apps were never really a viable solution, even to this day.
 
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MilaM

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2017
725
1,567
True. And it is because they ended releasing an App Store that they stopped caring to better support web apps. Web apps were never really a viable solution, even to this day.
And yet a lot of apps on the app stores are web apps in disguise, even on iOS.
 
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PDE

macrumors 68020
Nov 16, 2005
2,482
13
After decades of using Apple, and being heavily dependent on my Apple kit, this is the kind of anti customer attitude that will make me consider leaving the ecosystem. It saddens me that Apple has chosen this antagonistic path.
 

hans1972

macrumors 68040
Apr 5, 2010
3,346
2,927
Only 30 days? Most people do vacations for way longer than 30 days, it didn't have to be this complicated at all.

No, most people in the EU don't go on vacation outside the EU for about 5 consecutive weeks or more.
Even if you do, the app will still work.
 
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hans1972

macrumors 68040
Apr 5, 2010
3,346
2,927
I don't think Apple has ever done this kind of geofencing before. I used a US account on the App Store for years while I lived in Europe, you just need a US payment method.

They do in China, and also in some countries they disable certain hardware features.
 

j26

macrumors 68000
Mar 30, 2005
1,728
620
Paddyland
30 days is too short.
As has already been said, most tourist visas are 90 days, and some of us have unlimited rights of access to certain countries outside the EU.

I’m not as fussed about downloading new apps, but allowing security updates to existing apps should always be on.
 

TigerNike23

macrumors 6502a
Feb 13, 2017
849
2,051
Fort Myers, FL
And contracts are contracts. My prediction is, that this grace period is one of the first things Apple has to backtrack on. The terms of service can't change, just because a EU user moves around the globe.
Contracts mean nothing in other countries.

See Chinese copyright law.
 

TigerNike23

macrumors 6502a
Feb 13, 2017
849
2,051
Fort Myers, FL
True. And it is because they ended releasing an App Store that they stopped caring to better support web apps. Web apps were never really a viable solution, even to this day.
100%. In essence it was just another website built for iPhones. I do kind of miss that iPhone-built design they did, though.
 

bradman83

macrumors 6502a
Oct 29, 2020
960
2,385
Buffalo, NY
Friend, the United States can’t enforce the Digital Millennium Copyright Act in Portugal because it doesn’t have the authority. But you’re arguing the EU should have the authority of enforcing the DMA globally?

Apple will only do this when it’s forced to by law. That’s the decision it’s made through this process.
The United States can and does enforce certain laws on US citizens who live abroad. US citizens are still required to file and pay US taxes even though they are not on US soil. What the US cannot do is enforce its laws on non-US citizens abroad.

You are correct that the EU has no legal basis for forcing Apple to follow the DMA for non-EU users. But an EU citizen/resident with an EU-based Apple ID does not forfeit their legal protections under the DMA simply because they travel abroad. The Apple ID remains based in the EU even if the person physically is not.
 

MilaM

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2017
725
1,567
Contracts mean nothing in other countries.
I don't think you have thought this through. Apple still has branches in EU countries which are subject to local law. They can't void a contract between an EU resident and Apple's European branch easily.

Now if someone moves out of the EU, changes their payment details and address, then the laws of that other country would certainly apply. Otherwise, I think it will be difficult for Apple to enforce that grace period. Not impossible, but very difficult.
 
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spazzcat

macrumors 68040
Jun 29, 2007
3,727
4,891
Apple really wants another penalty fine from the EU. I hope that this time the fine goes into 10+ billion. No more slaps on the wrists
Apple doesn't pay fines, EU customers pay the fines through higher prices, I think it funny people keep asking for Apple to be fined. Also, they will most likely challenge the last fine.
 
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MilaM

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2017
725
1,567
Apple doesn't pay fines, EU customers pay the fines through higher prices, I think it funny people keep asking for Apple to be fined. Also, they will most likely challenge the last fine.
There are limits to price increases. Unless Apple wants to become the Ferrari of Smartphones. Very high margin and very low volume.
 

spazzcat

macrumors 68040
Jun 29, 2007
3,727
4,891
Maybe they prefer to spend their money on said vacation instead off on an expensive iPhones?
All corporations place a percentage of their profits into a fines fund. If the fund starts to get low, they raise prices by a few dollars to get the fund back up.
 

MilaM

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2017
725
1,567
All corporations place a percentage of their profits into a fines fund. If the fund starts to get low, they raise prices by a few dollars to get the fund back up.
Intersting thoght experiment. But why would they not increase the price by a few dollar even if there are no fines? Corporations are usually profit maximizing. Do you think Apple is currently generously leaving money on the table? My guess would be, no.
 

spazzcat

macrumors 68040
Jun 29, 2007
3,727
4,891
Intersting thoght experiment. But why would they not increase the price by a few dollar even if there are no fines? Corporations are usually profit maximizing. Do you think Apple is currently generously leaving money on the table? My guess would be, no.
Fines are a line item expense, I have firsthand knowledge of how corporations handle things like fines. There is a reason they don't work.
 
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