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seangrimes590

macrumors member
Jun 21, 2012
81
101
Villanova, PA
The computer pulls a consistent 92-97 watts after it fully heats up. This seems to be a hard limit imposed by the OS - either heat related or power related. It is the same limit with the Dell dock or with the Apple supplied charger in my testing (I tested the power limits previously with the Apple charger, posted on some thread somewhere on this site).

When the GPU is active, at ~20w, the CPU is allocated 45w. It runs around 2.9ghz. When I turn off the external display the CPU is allocated an additional 18-22w and runs at 3.3-3.4ghz. This behavior is consistent using the Dell dock and the Apple supplied charger. It’s either a pre-determined cooling limit or a power limit, either way Apple is limiting the power draw to 92-97 watts, regardless of charger connected in my testing. Pushing the GPU to 30watts (all I could get it up to) pulled another 7-8w away from the CPU forcing it to run around 38 watts and 2.4-2.5ghz.

During the hour long handbrake transcode and playing around with the GPU the system never pulled below 88 watts and never above 97 watts after the initial spike and settle. The first 2 seconds used 140 watts, the following 5 used 120 watts, the following 3 minutes used about 105 watts and then it settled into 92-97 watts. The battery percent, as reported by the OS (so for whatever that’s worth) never dropped from 100% in my hour long test. People who run at full load 24/7, while I think they should have a desktop, may or may not run into problems.

All in all the behavior is consistent with my previous MBP (2016) and my previous Razer blade 15” (8750h, 2070mq). Though razer *never* lets their CPU pull more than 45 watts in high power mode, limited to 35 watts in normal mode.

I’m very pleased with the Dell dock at this point. DP 1.4, full speed downstream thunderbolt port, and 90 watts of power which is sufficient for my needs. If you know you’re going to be running full load 24/7 I’d probably recommend waiting for the 100watt pluggable Titan Ridge dock that was just announced so you don’t have to worry about it.
 

carestudio

macrumors 6502a
Aug 6, 2008
653
164
Updated to Caldigit's TS3+ 87W firmware, so far so good. My new MBP 16" is holding pretty well with 87W, and 85W too actually. Nice to have extra 2W.
 

bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
4,311
2,703
I am new to all of this and really do not understand USB-C, but does this dongle facilitate a true 100w pass through giving a true 1 cable solution for 16" MBP?

"100 W Power Delivery
Maximum input of 100W minus 9W for the hub’s operation allows the hub to give your laptop up to an 90W pass-through charge while using other hub functions."

So no, it's around a 90W power delivery at most. With an Apple issued 96W charger, this probably drops down to around 85W power delivery.
 
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carestudio

macrumors 6502a
Aug 6, 2008
653
164
I am new to all of this and really do not understand USB-C, but does this dongle facilitate a true 100w pass through giving a true 1 cable solution for 16" MBP?

No. 100w is not possible. Pass through would be a good idea but using it along with apple charger would knock you down 10W to 12W or even more, plus, you need to consider the thermal problem as some pass through dongle does not have a good thermal design, and would damage your computer in a long run. Using a true thunderbolt or usb-c dock with proper hardware design is better and safer IMHO.
 

danwells

macrumors 6502a
Apr 4, 2015
778
611
The only way to get a true 100W off of a device that offers other ports (e.g. anything except a single-port charger) is to have the input wattage greater than 100W (which means that it can't be a USB-C input, unless Dell has a device that uses one of their nonstandard "USB-C" adapters).

Most Thunderbolt 3 docks have adapters that are well over 100W - the Plugable that has a 100W output uses a 170W input power supply (which also powers a bunch of USB ports and some logic circuits).

Anything that uses a 100W adapter as input (USB-C passthrough docks) needs to drain off at least a modest amount of that to power its own internal logic, and, if it's powering USB ports or the like, might drain more than a modest amount.
 

bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
4,311
2,703
Most Thunderbolt 3 docks have adapters that are well over 100W

That is the most maddening part of the TS3 Plus and firmware update. Not only did they release the update the day after the Apple holiday return window expired/ended, it was originally was promised to deliver 96W by CalDigit support. Then CalDigit backtracked or changed their mind and just upped from 85W to 87W.

The AC/DC adapter is LPS-190AB A model and advertised as a 180W PSU. There really is no reason this cannot handle 94W/96W/100W PD.


Spare AC Adapter 180W (PSU) for TS3 Plus- Thunderbolt 3 Docking Station
Thunderbolt Station 3 Plus Power Adapter

• 180 Watt OEM Power Supply
• Compatible with TS3 Plus
• 1 Pin Connector
• U.S. Power Cord (3ft) NEMA 5-15P to IEC-60320-C13
• 20V 9A
 

hajime

macrumors 604
Jul 23, 2007
7,807
1,233
No. 100w is not possible. Pass through would be a good idea but using it along with apple charger would knock you down 10W to 12W or even more, plus, you need to consider the thermal problem as some pass through dongle does not have a good thermal design, and would damage your computer in a long run. Using a true thunderbolt or usb-c dock with proper hardware design is better and safer IMHO.

That would defeat the point for me to buy a dock. I want only 1 cable out of the MBP.
 

matram

macrumors 6502a
Sep 18, 2011
781
416
Sweden
I kind of doubt this is possible. The TS3+ is rated at 85W. If only a FW upgrade could get it up to 100W that would mean power components would already have to have been dimensioned for 100W, in that case why not rate it at 100W. A FW tweak that would give a few Watt more maybe, but 15 W seems like it would need different HW.
 

bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
4,311
2,703
As a general FYI, support from CalDigit contacted me to state there are restrictions/regulations from Apple and Intel when working with TB3 and power delivery. They were limited to 87W max and it is "the best you will get from a docking station of its kind".

IF this statement is true, would keep an eye on that Pluggable dock. There is still certification they must adhere to before release, apparently.
 

seangrimes590

macrumors member
Jun 21, 2012
81
101
Villanova, PA
As a general FYI, support from CalDigit contacted me to state there are restrictions/regulations from Apple and Intel when working with TB3 and power delivery. They were limited to 87W max and it is "the best you will get from a docking station of its kind".

IF this statement is true, would keep an eye on that Pluggable dock. There is still certification they must adhere to before release, apparently.
Pretty sure this is for the older TB3 controller which CalDigit still uses. Not sure why they won't upgrade to Titan Ridge. The only docks over 87w are Titan Ridge docks.
 

seangrimes590

macrumors member
Jun 21, 2012
81
101
Villanova, PA
I use this new Baseus model.

No Thunderbolt and only supports 30hz on 4K displays. Seems pretty limited for all those ports.

Edit: Come on bro: "
  • Power supply adapter (12V/3A output) not included with this model.
    • use your own laptop power supply for best results (45W or higher).
"
 

Basic75

macrumors 68000
May 17, 2011
1,986
2,331
Europe
"100 W Power Delivery
Maximum input of 100W minus 9W for the hub’s operation allows the hub to give your laptop up to an 90W pass-through charge while using other hub functions."

So no, it's around a 90W power delivery at most. With an Apple issued 96W charger, this probably drops down to around 85W power delivery.
Though the drop doesn't really matter because even if you connect the power supply directly to the laptop, the hub will still need its power, and there's only one place it can come from, no?
 

bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
4,311
2,703
Though the drop doesn't really matter because even if you connect the power supply directly to the laptop, the hub will still need its power, and there's only one place it can come from, no?

Unsure for this particular USB-C hub, but theoretically yes. Though you could likely plug USB power directly into the hub as well, at least theoretically.

Hubs/docks with their own PSU are the better solution, even if using in combo with Apple 96W PSU.
 

Basic75

macrumors 68000
May 17, 2011
1,986
2,331
Europe
Unsure for this particular USB-C hub, but theoretically yes. Though you could likely plug USB power directly into the hub as well, at least theoretically.

Hubs/docks with their own PSU are the better solution, even if using in combo with Apple 96W PSU.
Sure, a hub with a say 120W PSU that can supply 100W to the computer, or using the Apple PSU attached to the computer and an independently powered hub will give best results when really taxing the system.
 

VArase

macrumors regular
Feb 1, 2008
114
60
Chicagoland
Basically looking for a dock that can fully power the MBP 16" with 96W (like an Apple charger) and offer "desktop replacement" style solutions to connect monitor(s), external storage, peripherals, possible eGPU, etc.

The closest I've seen that even might come close is the Targus DOCK190USZ, but it's out of stock and not sure it really meets the needs/specs.
[automerge]1573741919[/automerge]


I've reached out to CalDigit to confirm, but my understanding is this will only work if you're OK with the battery being partially drained during use. It only provides 85W of charging power.
Unfortunately, the Targus appears to be a USB 3.2 Gen 1 dock (10/20 gbps), not a Thunderbolt 3 dock (40 gbps) for $400.

Are we confused yet?
 

boomspot

macrumors regular
Apr 10, 2018
132
103
I was impatiently waiting for a true 100w dock but gave in and purchased the Caldigit TS3 dock. I've been running my setup off a single TB3 cable and it's been keeping the battery at 100%. I'm running a 1440p 34" display and a UA Apollo audio interface daisy-chained. So far so good!

B
 

VArase

macrumors regular
Feb 1, 2008
114
60
Chicagoland
Has anyone found a reputable docking solution that can deliver 96 watts or 100 watts of power for use with the new 16" MBP?

Making this first post a Wiki so it can be updated with links in the future.

----

AUKEY CB-C71 (AKA: Unity Link PD III 8-in-1 USB-C Hub with 100W PD)
Warning: Only provides 60W, despite advertising 100W passthrough
According to Aukey (on their product page), you can get an upgrade package if you have a 16 inch MacBook Pro.

I have no idea what that means, and I've written to Aukey and they requested a screenshot of my purchase order page on Amazon, but haven't heard back from them to find out what that package is/does.

IAC, since the 8-in-1 uses the Mac power brick as input, I wouldn't expect that it could provide more than around 83 watts (assuming that the 8-in-1 uses about 13 watts of that).
 

VArase

macrumors regular
Feb 1, 2008
114
60
Chicagoland
CalDigit is claiming they can do this. Will leave it to them to determine. They only shipped with 85W compatibility because that is what MBP's maxed out at previously. Their products are tailored to Apple/MBP with additional support as an added bonus.

The TS3 Plus has a 20V/9A DC input from their PSU, so it should be possible (at least theoretically) to provide up to 180W total for the device ports and USB-C PD/TB3. Even at 80W for device power and ports, would leave 100W for USB-C PD/TB3.
I don't really understand the logic of this - why limit it to 85 watts?

AFAIK, Power Delivery allows the charging device to offer up to 100 watts (20v @ 5a) - it's the device which determines how much of that power it wants.
 
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