The 2019-2020 Football Thread

[Strelok]

I though the loss against Sheffield United was the only league loss? I didn't check that, however.

Mourinho...ah, now there is a fellow with a very clear vision. No surprises with Mourinho. Of course, Mourinho's vision and the kind of football he produces is also the direct opposite of pretty much everything that makes Arsenal Arsenal. If the club are even half-seriously considering him, I'd say that that is credible evidence that somebody at Arsenal Football Club has gone mad.

Maybe it’s because I don’t like him, but he seems like a 1 season type of coach. He usually wins the first or second season with the other being OK and then everything falls apart in the third season. If you just want a quick win I guess he’s your guy, but longterm he doesn’t seem good.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Maybe it’s because I don’t like him, but he seems like a 1 season type of coach. He usually wins the first or second season with the other being OK and then everything falls apart in the third season. If you just want a quick win I guess he’s your guy, but longterm he doesn’t seem good.

To be quite candid, I don't like him, either; he is a negative, narcissistic and destructive force who - unfortunately - seems to deliver initial results in this first season in charge anywhere.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

To be quite candid, I don't like him, either; he is a negative, narcissistic and destructive force who - unfortunately - seems to deliver initial results in this first season in charge anywhere.

Yep, we've all explored the horror that is Mourinho on here many times before. He does bring one very important short-term advantage - instant resilience. Mourinho teams are always very hard to beat*. Something Arsenal could do with right now, frankly. But the cost of bringing Mourinho on board far outweighs the benefits, unless you plan to have him right the ship and then fire him after one season. That would be kind of funny - like a super-duper Sam Allardyce.

*During his first and second seasons. Third season Mourinho syndrome is a proven phenomenon, as everyone tires of his gaslighting antics.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Yep, we've all explored the horror that is Mourinho on here many times before. He does bring one very important short-term advantage - instant resilience. Mourinho teams are always very hard to beat*. Something Arsenal could do with right now, frankly. But the cost of bringing Mourinho on board far outweighs the benefits, unless you plan to have him right the ship and then fire him after one season. That would be kind of funny - like a super-duper Sam Allardyce.

*During his first and second seasons. Third season Mourinho syndrome is a proven phenomenon, as everyone tires of his gaslighting antics.

Agreed.

Yes, Arsenal do need both mental and physical resilience and strength, and this is indeed one factor that The Chosen One brings to the teams he manages.

But, I will admit that his toxic personality, and narcissistic negativity are features of his character that I find deeply repellant and unpalatable.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Wenger to Bayern? Seemingly as a one-year stopgap as well. Interesting.

My Arsenal supporting co-worker doesn't believe the somewhat outlandish Mourinho to Arsenal rumors, but said that if by some chance they turn out to be true he is done with the club. He's been supporting them since before Wenger, so he's no Johhny-come-lately fan.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Wenger to Bayern? Seemingly as a one-year stopgap as well. Interesting.

My Arsenal supporting co-worker doesn't believe the somewhat outlandish Mourinho to Arsenal rumors, but said that if by some chance they turn out to be true he is done with the club. He's been supporting them since before Wenger, so he's no Johhny-come-lately fan.

Actually, I just read an article (in the Guardian) linking Mr Wenger with Bayern, as a one year stop gap; fascinating.

For what it is worth, I've been supporting those heart-breakers since I was a small child when I watched the Double Winning Team of 1971 actually win the FA Cup. Highs and lows.

Re the Mourinho rumours, that is not Arsenal's style (or, at the very least, I sincerely hope that it does not become Arsenal's style), but that the rumours exist at all, in the first place, is telling, and does suggest that Emery's position might be a bit less secure than one might have thought.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

For what it is worth, I've been supporting those heart-breakers since I was a small child when I watched the Double Winning Team of 1971 actually win the FA Cup. Highs and lows.

Found a digital copy of that match and watched it a couple years ago. Absolutely fascinating to see how the game has evolved since then. You have to watch matches from before the TV era to really appreciate how things have changed. It makes you wonder what it would be like to watch matches from the 1930s or even earlier.

And just imagine what it was like playing in a wool/cotton (or even early-generation synthetic) uniform with heavy leather shoes and that heavy brain-busting ball.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Found a digital copy of that match and watched it a couple years ago. Absolutely fascinating to see how the game has evolved since then. You have to watch matches from before the TV era to really appreciate how things have changed. It makes you wonder what it would be like to watch matches from the 1930s or even earlier.

And just imagine what it was like playing in a wool/cotton (or even early-generation synthetic) uniform with heavy leather shoes and that heavy brain-busting ball.

Actually, I've read a number of fascinating pieces on what passed for tactics in the late 19th century, (the astonishing number of forwards on early teams, for example, and how tactical changes gradually reduced this number to something resembling what we see today) and on the various changes that have occurred since then.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Actually, I've read a number of fascinating pieces on what passed for tactics in the late 19th century, (the astonishing number of forwards on early teams, for example, and how tactical changes gradually reduced this number to something resembling what we see today) and on the various changes that have occurred since then.

When you think of football literature you usually think of ghostwritten player biographies, but there is plenty of highbrow lit out there that really gets into the essence of the sport, its history, and its entanglement with all aspects of human culture.

The two must-read books for understanding the evolution of the game and its tactics, in my opinion, are David Goldblatt's The Ball is Round and Johnathan Wilson's Inverting the Pyramid. Some might find them tedious (and neither is a short read!), but they really do contextualize the sport, trace the evolution of tactics, and explain how it developed from its origins to today.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

When you think of football literature you usually think of ghostwritten player biographies, but there is plenty of highbrow lit out there that really gets into the essence of the sport, its history, and its entanglement with all aspects of human culture.

The two must-read books for understanding the evolution of the game and its tactics, in my opinion, are David Goldblatt's The Ball is Round and Johnathan Wilson's Inverting the Pyramid. Some might find them tedious (and neither is a short read!), but they really do contextualize the sport, trace the evolution of tactics, and explain how it developed from its origins to today.

Agreed, that there are some excellent books on football (and ghostwritten player autobiographies/biographies do not count; most are poorly written and utterly banal).

However, in recent years, I read Jonathan Wilson's excellent "Angels With Dirty Faces", and earlier, was enormously impressed by both Simon Kuper's "Football Against The Enemy" and Nick Hornby's "Fever Pitch" which were superb.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

I feel the need to get in the excuses early for Sunday....it's just one league match, even if Liverpool lose the title race is still very much on, etc etc. I don't think Ederson's absence will make a massive difference (I'd feel the same if Adrian was playing for Liverpool).

I'll be on a road trip for work and so will miss the match, but I hope at least it is a good, clean, exciting game that is NOT decided by a fluke goal, a dodgy call or...for goodness' sake...by VAR.

 

[ScrumpyDaniel]

FA Cup for us (Ipswich) tomorrow, first time we've been in the first round since 1957. Lincoln at home, I'd like to think we should be able to win it, but we've not won an FA Cup tie for 10 years ?. Looking forward to it though.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I feel the need to get in the excuses early for Sunday....it's just one league match, even if Liverpool lose the title race is still very much on, etc etc. I don't think Ederson's absence will make a massive difference (I'd feel the same if Adrian was playing for Liverpool).

I'll be on a road trip for work and so will miss the match, but I hope at least it is a good, clean, exciting game that is NOT decided by a fluke goal, a dodgy call or...for goodness' sake...by VAR.

There is no need for Liverpool to assume that they will be defeated; at this stage, they are the only club in the Premiership not to have suffered a defeat.

Indeed, a draw would leave things nicely as they are, whereas a victory - which I, for one, would love to see, would confirm their pre-eminence and position in the table.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

There is no need for Liverpool to assume that they will be defeated; at this stage, they are the only club in the Premiership not to have suffered a defeat.

Indeed, a draw would leave things nicely as they are, whereas a victory - which I, for one, would love to see, would confirm their pre-eminence and position in the table.

I expect things to play out as last season - tense draw at Anfield, Man City win at the Etihad. Liverpool are less defensively solid this season but paradoxically harder to beat (thus far). Salah is a little off the boil at the moment, but the Ox is in a good vein of form and Lallana is working his way back into being a useful player from the bench. Milner is there to plug holes wherever he is needed and bury penalty kicks like a purpose-built robot. Big Virgil and Hendo are avaiable, so Liverpool are very nearly full strength apart from long-term injuries. I think this will be a big match for Fabinho - he will be expected to put in a major shift protecting the defense.

If Liverpool win, I hope it's a 96th-minute Origi thriller. To keep the legend growing.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I expect things to play out as last season - tense draw at Anfield, Man City win at the Etihad. Liverpool are less defensively solid this season but paradoxically harder to beat (thus far). Salah is a little off the boil at the moment, but the Ox is in a good vein of form and Lallana is working his way back into being a useful player from the bench. Milner is there to plug holes wherever he is needed and bury penalty kicks like a purpose-built robot. Big Virgil and Hendo are avaiable, so Liverpool are very nearly full strength apart from long-term injuries. I think this will be a big match for Fabinho - he will be expected to put in a major shift protecting the defense.

If Liverpool win, I hope it's a 96th-minute Origi thriller. To keep the legend growing.

Oddly enough, I think the "zeitgeist" is with Liverpool this season.

They won the CL last year (and were finalists the year before) and came second in the PL - by a point having been defeated once all season - to one of the best teams ever to play football.

Paradoxically, I think that the PL is in Liverpool's hands this season, and Liverpool's to win; Manchester City - having won over the past two years - will, I think, be more motivated to try to do well in Europe, than to retain their PL crown.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Paradoxically, I think that the PL is in Liverpool's hands this season, and Liverpool's to win; Manchester City - having won over the past two years - will, I think, be more motivated to try to do well in Europe, than to retain their PL crown.

While Pep is feeling the pressure to succeed in Europe, it is not in his nature to go easy on one major competition in order to favor another - he will do everything he can to win both. I think it's going to be close either way.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

While Pep is feeling the pressure to succeed in Europe, it is not in his nature to go easy on one major competition in order to favor another - he will do everything he can to win both. I think it's going to be close either way.

Yes, agreed, it is going to be close, and Pep will remain exceedingly competitive no matter what the competition is, but - for the PL - as things stand, I think that this could Liverpool's year.

The fact that they won the CL last year, instead of suffering the fate of being runners-up again, was, I would argue, a massive boost to their confidence and self-belief this year.

They know that they can beat the best the continent can throw at them, and they are learning how to win ugly, and grind out victories - an invaluable skill in the tool-kit of would-be PL champions - as well as win pretty.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

The fact that they won the CL last year, instead of suffering the fate of being runners-up again, was, I would argue, a massive boost to their confidence and self-belief this year.

One of Liverpool's best assets at the moment is a total belief that victory is always possible. Pundits blather endlessly about top teams having a "winning mentality" but there is more then a grain of truth to it. There is no team on the planet that Liverpool fear, and they won't give up even when losing late in a match because they will expect their efforts to pay off in the end. It is perhaps an overrated quality, but it really does make a difference.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

One of Liverpool's best assets at the moment is a total belief that victory is always possible. Pundits blather endlessly about top teams having a "winning mentality" but there is more then a grain of truth to it. There is no team on the planet that Liverpool fear, and they won't give up even when losing late in a match because they will expect their efforts to pay off in the end. It is perhaps an overrated quality, but it really does make a difference.

Agreed: It makes a difference most of all in the years you actually win trophies, and is one of the most signifiant (even if intangible) factors in ensuring such success.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Oh dear, Arsenal.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Oh dear, Arsenal.

Unless Emery can put together a string run of results immediately (which does not look likely on current evidence), it's not looking good for the Arsenal manager. With that being said, Leicester are a really good team and they are not in second place right now by accident. Also, despite everyone claiming Arsenal are in crisis, they are still 6th and ahead of Spurs and Man United in the table. The season is far from lost,e ven if the mood around the squad and the fans seems grim.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Unless Emery can put together a string run of results immediately (which does not look likely on current evidence), it's not looking good for the Arsenal manager. With that being said, Leicester are a really good team and they are not in second place right now by accident. Also, despite everyone claiming Arsenal are in crisis, they are still 6th and ahead of Spurs and Man United in the table. The season is far from lost,e ven if the mood around the squad and the fans seems grim.

Some of the Arsenal fans seem to be weirdly entitled, and their behaviour in the late Arsene Wenger days - and, indeed, more recently, with Granit Xhaka, left a lot to be desired.

Having said that, Umai Emery does not seem to have been able to impose his authority on the team, and nor does he seem to have begun to address (yes, it will take several transfer windows) the very visible problems in that defence.

I don't think that Arsenal are in crisis, - their mid field is okay and their forwards excellent - but I do think that they are unable to implement whatever vision Emery has in mind of the team, - they lack the will or the skills - and I am astounded that little attempt has been made to begin to address those perennial and glaring defensive frailties.

He bought an excellent goalkeeper, who has been asked to do far too much in his position as the defence consistently fails to protect him, (but who - notwithstanding that - probably should be selected as captain).

Choosing a team captain by team vote, suggests a curious lack of authority (and perhaps, respect) in the dressing room - certainly, I have never heard of a captain chosen by such a method, but Emery was perfectly right to strip Xhaka of the captaincy for his conduct (stripping off his shirt, and the captain's arm-band, and swearing at the fans) as he left the pitch a fortnight ago.

Leicester are an excellent side, and were clearly up for the match, and obviously deserved their victory.

The only positive thing that I could see was the return of both Holding and Bellerin to the Arsenal side, and, although neither are particularly match fit just now, that will come in time.

 

[Strelok]

I’m confused how that wasn’t a penalty for MC, pretty clear handball. Now MC down by 2, pretty big mistake there.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I’m confused how that wasn’t a penalty for MC, pretty clear handball. Now MC down by 2, pretty big mistake there.

Liverpool have had a lot of decisions go there way this year.

 

[Strelok]

Liverpool have had a lot of decisions go there way this year.

Although that still doesn’t mean MC players all had to stop playing and just complain to the referee. I don’t understand that mentality, and sadly it’s very prevalent in football ?