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Gamer Nexus vs. Linus Media Group
- Thread starter maflynn
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Part of his closing comments (currently) to the LTT fiasco:
Paul said:
I’ve seen a smattering of LTT videos over the years but never been a fan. Furthermore, I don’t care if LMG rebounds or not, I’ll continue to (mostly) ignore their content. Nonetheless, lastly, while this is presumably not going to mirror the Artesian Builds collapse, to me, its looking like a similar ship with a young(er), arrogant captain ultimately willing to do whatever it takes to save his ego.
I really like Paul's videos, he may not be the fastest out the door, but he generally has a great perspective and I enjoy his humor. His reporting of this was succinct and professional with some good insights
If nothing else it will maybe make people a bit more cautious about YT reviews. I have been saying it for years and years. They all want and need your views. It's how they mostly make money or in the case of LTT how they started making money and would like to continue seeing it continue despite all their other income streams.
Let's turn for a moment to all the ****-bag Apple reviewers out there. Even worse when it comes to releasing videos that are very very poor when it comes to data and in fact the truth. Why focus on giving the consumer/viewer the right information when all you want them to do is watch to get the view count up?
Treat all YouTubers like politicians, just because their lips move, doesn't mean they are right or accurate.
Let's turn for a moment to all the ****-bag Apple reviewers out there. Even worse when it comes to releasing videos that are very very poor when it comes to data and in fact the truth. Why focus on giving the consumer/viewer the right information when all you want them to do is watch to get the view count up?
Treat all YouTubers like politicians, just because their lips move, doesn't mean they are right or accurate.
Totally agree is solely about the money and the likes of LMG are just better with the soft soap. Last place to go for an unbiased review is YT...
Not missed LMG from my feed and more inclined to block as I want a more diverse opinions as they serve purpose...
Q-6
This just seems weird. Were there any groundbreaking games to use to benchmark games in 2021? Don't forget, Apple also used Tomb Raider when discussing Rosetta. Cyberpunk was a mess at launch, so it makes sense that wasn't included. Final Fantasy 7 Remake was a micro-stutter mess and you needed to drop it to an earlier DirectX to play it well.
JayZTwoCents, Hardware Unboxed and others use similar games. I am not sure why a 2018 (and even a 2020 game Flight Simulator) being reviewed for a GPU in 2021 deserves a rant?
I can understand and have more sympathy if you are talking about using a 2006 game to review a GPU in 2021. But complaining that you use a 2018 game for a GPU in 2021? Just seems very strange to me.
Nothing from this video and the arguments can be equated to "fraud" to me. Sponsorships happen all the time.So what Linus had a video on Intel's channel. I don't think that equates to "fraud".
Plus, those CD key websites are not really legal so that kind of hurts all of his arguments. OEM keys are technically not allowed to be used by YOU, they are used when you install it for someone else as a business. OEM licenses are for the Dells and Starforge Gaming companies to sell YOU the license. So what Gamers Nexus commented on it. Does that mean he can NEVER EVER say ANYTHING about Linus because he agreed with him on ONE thing?
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The reception to that YouTube video doesn’t seem very positive. His audience is going after him and he’s having a meltdown over it.
Coreteks audience? Unless he removed a lot I see nothing but agreements in the comments on that YouTube video.
Yeah, he’s deleting comments and shadowbanning people that disagree with him.
I just don't get it. Remember Steve exposed Newegg and helped people with their situations? MANY times Steve has purchased faulty products from people to help them out. And the whole "don't get sponsored for reviews" is a bad take. Everybody gets sponsored. He even got sponsored with the CD Key site, and I did find a comment of him saying how legal and above board it is when it is NOT!
A bit different, Apple was specific about their choice to prove/justify Rosetta. The other games wouldn't have run as well for demo purposes. Although Tomb Raider didn't run that well under Rosetta it was still impressive and proved their point as we entered the Arm chip era.
I started watching that video and I just walked away scratching my head. Its like he was trying to say look at me, I was the first to identify the issue. He seemed upset or annoyed that Steve's video garnered traction where his tweets caused quite a bit pushback from the community. Additionally he started attacking Steve on his use of sponsored videos. Now I'm no GN fanboy but I'm not sure about his accusation that Steve is just as unethical because Gamer Nexus doing sponsored videos and reviews. One thing that Steve does is on reviews is back any statements up with facts and numbers. I do find his videos overly long (sometimes too long, but he does back up his words
As for the accusation regarding LTT's game selection, I really do find that odd, I'm ok with the suite of games simply because its a lower common denominator where most people are playing or have payed those games and provides a great point of reference. Could LTT add more games into the mix, sure, but attacking Linus for selecting Tomb Raider seems rather silly and nit-picky - just my $.02
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you missed where I named two but have seen many more channels use this same game to benchmark Windows systems.
Okay? It was just one example. Not sure why it needs a paragraph explaining why it’s different. That wasn’t my basis for the argument. Was just one sentence in my large post.
They (Apple) still chose Tomb Raider to demo. Just like LTT and a dozen others. This also wasn’t the only game shown. Again just like LTT and dozens of others.
It’s taking this guys ridiculous arguments and applying it to similar scenarios. Apple also chose to demo an “old” game.
The point is, it doesn’t matter AT ALL that these channels and Apple uses Tomb Raider for whatever they are trying to discuss. It’s not an “old” game.
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When these sorts of things happen, the first months are usually the most brutal. If they can survive the first several months of backlash, there is usually somewhat of a resurgence of support and a window afterwards where they can have a comeback (even if nearly the entire internet was turned against them before). We've seen this thing happen many times before on the internet and in the public eye.
I definitely don't think LTT is doomed to failure, and I don't believe the writing is on the wall quite yet either. But a lot of their future depends very strongly on how they handle the allegations (and what they do in response to the findings of the investigation). The way that they handle this will likely make or break the future of the company, and I do hope that Madison is treated fairly and that the investigation is taken seriously.
I definitely don't think LTT is doomed to failure, and I don't believe the writing is on the wall quite yet either. But a lot of their future depends very strongly on how they handle the allegations (and what they do in response to the findings of the investigation). The way that they handle this will likely make or break the future of the company, and I do hope that Madison is treated fairly and that the investigation is taken seriously.
It is stuck for some reason. Social Blade seems to be more accurate.
I don't know the reasons, but it seems LTT seems to have stabilized back to 15.4 million viewers, At this point, I think things are settling down. The media feeding frenzy has died down, LTT is (probably) doing its re-training/refocusing and the Madison investigations are presumably ongoing.
Does it necessarily matter what games they use to benchmark if the benchmarks are consistent across products? I don’t see the logic in saying “don’t benchmark old games.”
That said, benchmarking is just a huge cluster**** in general. There’s a huge number of variables that typically aren’t accounted for in a two dimensional graph. Case in point, GN’s video with an Intel engineer on a new open source benchmark program.
That said, benchmarking is just a huge cluster**** in general. There’s a huge number of variables that typically aren’t accounted for in a two dimensional graph. Case in point, GN’s video with an Intel engineer on a new open source benchmark program.
Yes agrees. I have never. Not ONCE gotten the same performance that they speak about. And it makes sense right. They test in isolation. I have Discord, active Steam chats, maybe a Word document open in the background.
I’ve had thoughts about benchmarking for awhile now and I honestly put little stock into synthetic tests anymore. At least with benchmarks of programs directly you get results accurate-ish to what you’re looking for.
I think he came off a bit tone-deaf in the response but I do also think it's not Luke's place to "rein Linus in" - Linus is (or was) his BOSS. This is hopefully what the CEO and legal department can focus on, now that these are other people and not Linus himself.
GN have long had a history of calling people out for shady stuff, be it OEM behaviour, reviewer behaviour (e.g., those intel shills who's name escapes me right now), etc.
Steve is very careful to deal only in facts; as he mentions in the video LTT's behaviour when corrected has been as much of an issue as the review accuracy itself.
Reposting a video in place is the worst. They're doing it to maintain view counts for revenue purposes, but for someone who saw v1 of the video, the will never see that there's a corrected v2. This is a massive issue. It's like newspapers re-writing the news rather than publishing a retraction.
And their flagrant disregard for the impact their low-effort, inaccurate review may have had to somebody's livelihood (never mind selling the prototype) just reinforces the ethical problems inside the company. Linus couldn't afford (more like, couldn't be bothered) to re-test that block with a 3090? please. This is the guy behind 7 gamers one CPU, the petabyte NAS project, etc.
And to then double-down on this? Dude...
That assumes that GN see LTT as competition. I for one don't, and I doubt Steve does at this point either. They've been pure entertainment for several years now, whereas GN has been heavily focused on things they can prove; and are up-front about their methods and any discrepancies they may find.
It's like saying that Netflix and eBay are competitors. They're both web sites that want a cut of your money, but....
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