The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming

[PickUrPoison]

Your cynicism is far from charming.

You miss my point anyway. That is that, whereas retailers, around where I am at, found it worthwhile stocking the previous generation of the Mac Mini, but no longer stock the current generation, presumably because it didn't sell when they did.

The average geek might be in awe of the increased performance over the previous generation. However, for the average Joe or Jill, not seeking to make movies and so on, a more modestly performing machine, with a decent amount of on board storage, at a more reasonable price is a more attractive proposition..... as was the case with the previous generation.

How do you know I want a 4GB/HDD Mac Mini, and don't want a MacBook? I have both already.

I prefer work on a desktop, but need to take a computer to work much more these days, so with some reluctance I bought a modestly specced MacBook Air last year. I hoped it would supplement the desktop, but it has not proved to be the case with the 2009 Mac Mini, which is stuck on El Capitan. Once updated to modern versions of apps on the Air, documents and files are not backwardly compatible.

At 10 years old my Mac Mini has done well. It is still running the original 120 GB HDD, but sooner or later that will fail. It cannot be updated beyond El Capitan, and lacks modern connectivity, so it has become obsolete, thus would not be worth repairing...... but the current Mac Mini specced with reasonable amount of storage would set me back 6 weeks pay.... not a goer I reckon.

A 500 GB HDD and a 512 GB SSD are compatible from my point of view. The amount of storage available is what I am interested in. Speed of access matters for some, but from my point of view it is not a major. Once an app or file is open, it is the CPU and RAM that affect usability.....


Sure are, from the point of view of Joe Average.


Good question @PickUrPoison. Do you understand the target market for the Mac Mini?

I would have been, average Joe that I am...... but the current Mac Mini offering is not a fit for my budget and needs.

Personal insults aside, I understand quite clearly the target market. But do you? I see no evidence of that.

There’s a reason that on the Apple mini website pages, it talks about working with massive files, being able to run multiple virtual machines and setting up render farms. There’s a reason the mini has a $100 optional 10GbE port. Unfortunately, none of those reasons is consistent in any way with the new mini being a suitable replacement for your particular use case.

The mini is no longer targeted at “switchers” or even home users or as a cheaper, entry level introduction to Macintosh. (That positioning nearly killed the mini btw, maybe because that market only buys a new computer every 10 years.) You are no longer the target market. Whether or not you want them, the configs that would have made the base mini less expensive than $799—4GB, HDD/Fusion drives—are no longer available, as they are unwanted by the target market.

What you call cynicism is actually realism. I prefer not to live in a dream world where I believe my specific requirements should be met by Apple, or where Apple sells their products at low profit margins.

You may find it harsh, but the reality is that Apple doesn’t owe you your perfect mini configuration at your price. Wanting a slower U-series CPU is rather misguided—they’re more expensive than the desktop CPUs Apple uses in the mini, and as such would only further increase the price.

The 2018 mini is at least a few hundred dollars cheaper than a similarly configured iMac or MBA/MBP, while offering its own advantages: faster CPUs, higher RAM capacity (user upgradeable), more I/O bandwidth, etc. How much do you want to pay for the base mini? $399? $599? $699? Unfortunately, that’s not possible; here’s why.

Apple has about a 20% overall profit margin, which means a $799 mini costs Apple around $650. The 16GB/512GB config some want as a “proper” base mini costs Apple $1,150. Hey I’d love to get a mini for $499 or $599, but how is that possible? Apple simply is NOT going to sell at a loss. That’s in no way a realistic possibility, and it’s hardly being cynical to acknowledge that reality.

 

[Micky Do]

Unfortunately, very few people want what you want—a 4GB/HDD mini. You also can’t get a 4GB, HDD, Fusion or non-retina MacBook Pro config anymore. They’re effectively obsolete and there’s little demand. You can’t expect Apple to keep those SKUs around when so few people want to buy them.

In a couple years you’ll be able to get a good deal on a used 2018 to replace your 2009 mini. That should hold you until at least 2030, maybe even 2035. I’m pretty sure that’s your best course of action, assuming you want to continue running MacOS (and you don’t want a MacBook or iMac).

I get it..... being totally realistic here, not the slightest bit cynical or insulting.

Personal insults aside, I understand quite clearly the target market. But do you? I see no evidence of that.

There’s a reason that on the Apple mini website pages, it talks about working with massive files, being able to run multiple virtual machines and setting up render farms. There’s a reason the mini has a $100 optional 10GbE port. Unfortunately, none of those reasons is consistent in any way with the new mini being a suitable replacement for your particular use case.

The mini is no longer targeted at “switchers” or even home users or as a cheaper, entry level introduction to Macintosh. (That positioning nearly killed the mini btw, maybe because that market only buys a new computer every 10 years.) You are no longer the target market. Whether or not you want them, the configs that would have made the base mini less expensive than $799—4GB, HDD/Fusion drives—are no longer available, as they are unwanted by the target market.

What you call cynicism is actually realism. I prefer not to live in a dream world where I believe my specific requirements should be met by Apple, or where Apple sells their products at low profit margins.

You may find it harsh, but the reality is that Apple doesn’t owe you your perfect mini configuration at your price. Wanting a slower U-series CPU is rather misguided—they’re more expensive than the desktop CPUs Apple uses in the mini, and as such would only further increase the price.

The 2018 mini is at least a few hundred dollars cheaper than a similarly configured iMac or MBA/MBP, while offering its own advantages: faster CPUs, higher RAM capacity (user upgradeable), more I/O bandwidth, etc. How much do you want to pay for the base mini? $399? $599? $699? Unfortunately, that’s not possible; here’s why.

Apple has about a 20% overall profit margin, which means a $799 mini costs Apple around $650. The 16GB/512GB config some want as a “proper” base mini costs Apple $1,150. Hey I’d love to get a mini for $499 or $599, but how is that possible? Apple simply is NOT going to sell at a loss. That’s in no way realistic, and it’s hardly being cynical to acknowledge that reality.

So, being so knowledgeable, we must assume you work Apple's marketing department.

Yeah, yeah..... the latest incarnation of the Mac Mini has disappeared from stores because Apple has lost interest the small niche of consumers who would like a modestly performing Mac in consumer spec to put on their desk at a reasonable price. No doubt there are not enough Mac Minis to put on display because they are in such massive demand by corporations and pros.

 

[PickUrPoison]

I get it..... being totally realistic here, not the slightest bit cynical or insulting.

Correct, every statement is 100% real. No idea what you think is either cynical or insulting about either of those paragraphs. Apparently you want me to sugarcoat my opinion; sorry, that’s not my job. Especially since we’ve gone around and around on this very subject several times.

So, being so knowledgeable, we must assume you work Apple's marketing department.

You can assume whatever you wish.

You might even assume that 1) I read the rumors circulating before the mini’s release that Apple was going upmarket (so much so that some around here started talking about the upcoming Mac mini Pro, in a new larger enclosure) specifically by using higher end components; 2) I watched the launch event; and furthermore 3) I just spent three or four minutes looking at the mini’s landing page on the Apple website. (And if that’s your assumption, you’d actually be right.)

Yeah, yeah..... the latest incarnation of the Mac Mini has disappeared from stores because Apple has lost interest the small niche of consumers who would like a modestly performing Mac in consumer spec to put on their desk at a reasonable price. No doubt there are not enough Mac Minis to put on display because they are in such massive demand by corporations and pros.

I don’t remember what country you live in, but if the mini isn’t in demand at retail, I would think there’s little point to dedicating display space to it. If Apple doesn’t have the machine you think people want, what would there be to display? 80% of customers by a laptop, and another 10-15% buy iMac. That leaves 5-10% split between Mac mini, iMac Pro and Mac Pro. Maybe none of those are on display, depending on how well they sell locally.

You keep mentioning a “modestly performing” mini. What does that mean to you? You were offended when I suggested you meant 4GB RAM, HDD or Fusion drives, and I’ve already told you the lower performing U-series CPU you want is more expensive than the $133 quad i3 that’s currently in the base mini.

So if you really want to continue the discussion of ”what is Micky Do’s dream mini config and what does he think it should cost”, then please get specific. Rather than just whining and complaining about what is—aka reality—what do you propose in the alternative, and how much do you want to pay for it? Maybe that will allow the discussion to make some forward progress.

 

[Miat]

There’s a reason that on the Apple mini website pages, it talks about working with massive files, being able to run multiple virtual machines and setting up render farms. There’s a reason the mini has a $100 optional 10GbE port.

And an i7 / 128GB option.

 

[toke lahti]

I'm still of-topic here, but since I'm in APFS-hell with my "new" mini, I'd like to ask, does anybody know can Mojave TM-backup be restored to external APFS disk?
I'm asking, since I just learned that in High Sierra, you can't...

In what forum I should ask this?

 

[Lankyman]

Fusion drives are junk. A spinner with a little SSD is another joke Apple plays on us. But we’re not laughing.

I am, I love mine despite owning a full SSD iMac. For the majority of ordinary users the Fusion drive is a great option.

 

[Zdigital2015]

Correct, every statement is 100% real. No idea what you think is either cynical or insulting about either of those paragraphs. Apparently you want me to sugarcoat my opinion; sorry, that’s not my job. Especially since we’ve gone around and around on this very subject several times.


You can assume whatever you wish.

You might even assume that 1) I read the rumors circulating before the mini’s release that Apple was going upmarket (so much so that some around here started talking about the upcoming Mac mini Pro, in a new larger enclosure) specifically by using higher end components; 2) I watched the launch event; and furthermore 3) I just spent three or four minutes looking at the mini’s landing page on the Apple website. (And if that’s your assumption, you’d actually be right.)


I don’t remember what country you live in, but if the mini isn’t in demand at retail, I would think there’s little point to dedicating display space to it. If Apple doesn’t have the machine you think people want, what would there be to display? 80% of customers by a laptop, and another 10-15% buy iMac. That leaves 5-10% split between Mac mini, iMac Pro and Mac Pro. Maybe none of those are on display, depending on how well they sell locally.

You keep mentioning a “modestly performing” mini. What does that mean to you? You were offended when I suggested you meant 4GB RAM, HDD or Fusion drives, and I’ve already told you the lower performing U-series CPU you want is more expensive than the $133 quad i3 that’s currently in the base mini.

So if you really want to continue the discussion of ”what is Micky Do’s dream mini config and what does he think it should cost”, then please get specific. Rather than just whining and complaining about what is—aka reality—what do you propose in the alternative, and how much do you want to pay for it? Maybe that will allow the discussion to make some forward progress.

I honestly believe that part of Apple's looooong term strategy is to raise the prices of Intel-based Macs to create breathing room for A-Series Macs because there is going to be a much longer rate of uptake and the transition to them will be much longer than any other previous transition.

My reasoning is that the 680x0-->PowerPC transition and the PowerPC-->Intel transition were so short was borne out of necessity as both CPU lines had essentially come to the end of the road. Motorola had the 68060, but not much incentive beyond that as Apple was essentially their only volume customer at the time. PowerPC began branching into POWER (big iron) and PowerPC (consumer), but had essentially stalled out at the G5 and IBM seemed reluctant to continue R&D on a consumer CPU that they had to sell as a part as opposed to a server/mainframe CPU with huge markup that could be sold as part of a "solution" (maintenance, support, custom solutions, et al.) that better monetized IBM service focus changeover back in the early/mid 2000s. Apple moving from Intel to ARM has to be much longer and parallel as Intel is not going to taper off making x86 CPUs and the demand for that compatibility creates a completely unique situation compared to the two previous situations.

I also think Apple has put Intel Macs on a sort of glide path to an extent and may be keeping some of their more innovative ideas behind the curtains until they are ready to start aggressively marketing ARM-based Macs. Those innovations will drive their business through the transition, while Intel die-hards complain mightily all along the way. Regardless, I think Apple is trying to make as much profit and drive as much of its business to iOS along with their back door plans to allow devs to port to macOS using Catalyst. Time will tell if I am right or all wet.

 

[Berg0]

No love for new Minis? Have we finally let this thread run out of steam?

They priced too many people out of it I think. They did me for sure.

 

[mryingster]

They priced too many people out of it I think. They did me for sure.

It certainly is higher than I had hoped for, but I am mostly annoyed at the soldered on storage. I'm probably still going to buy one, but I'd be a lot more eager if I knew I could replace the storage whenever I felt like it.

 

[hagjohn]

Apple just hired Mike Filippo who used to be ARM's lead CPU and system architect. Move towards MAC ARM processors or additional hire for iPhone/iPad processors?

 

[Berg0]

It certainly is higher than I had hoped for, but I am mostly annoyed at the soldered on storage. I'm probably still going to buy one, but I'd be a lot more eager if I knew I could replace the storage whenever I felt like it.

I'm the same way. If they'd release even a barebones MacMini that I'd have to buy my own storage/ram for I'd probably be looking into getting one. Hopefully if they ever get around to switching to an ARM based architecture they'll be cheaper and more reasonably priced.

 

[Lankyman]

I'm the same way. If they'd release even a barebones MacMini that I'd have to buy my own storage/ram for I'd probably be looking into getting one. Hopefully if they ever get around to switching to an ARM based architecture they'll be cheaper and more reasonably priced.

Why would you assume that Apple would price an ARM based model any cheaper than an Intel?

 

[Berg0]

Why would you assume that Apple would price an ARM based model any cheaper than an Intel?

Wishful thinking that if apple lowers cost of production they'll pass some of that onto the custom. I don't EXPECT it to happen, if anything they'll try and tout how innovative it is and charge more, since that's what apple usually does.

 

[PickUrPoison]

Apple just hired Mike Filippo who used to be ARM's lead CPU and system architect. Move towards MAC ARM processors or additional hire for iPhone/iPad processors?

Either/both.

 

[ridgero]

Do you think the Mac mini gets a small refresh in 2019?

 

[deconstruct60]

I'm still of-topic here, but since I'm in APFS-hell with my "new" mini, I'd like to ask, does anybody know can Mojave TM-backup be restored to external APFS disk?
I'm asking, since I just learned that in High Sierra, you can't...

You are booted into recovery mode , with an external volume formatted in APFS attached and can't see the APFS container/volume ? [ Perhaps the older 10.13 (High Sierra ) APFS implementation doesn't recogrnize the new container. ]

You should be able to boot an Mojave USB installer and switch to it's "recovery mode" set of utilities.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Do you think the Mac mini gets a small refresh in 2019?

No.

 

[twalk]

Do you think the Mac mini gets a small refresh in 2019?

I would find that to be really doubtful. About the only reason for them to have a processor upgrade would be to move to the much faster video speed of some of the 10th gen Intel parts. Those won't be in quantity for something like a Mini until probably 2nd half of next year

 

[kazmac]

I would have jumped if

1) the WiFi and Bluetooth issues weren't present
2) The Mini came with a better GPU

It's a bummer. I really like the Mini, but cannot justify one especially with the WiFi/Bluetooth issues and having to buy a GPU. I was so gutted to experience WiFi dropouts and bluetooth issues at the 5th Avenue Apple store. I did like the new LG display too.

Oh well.

I'd love it if Apple fixed the WiFi and Bluetooth issues and put in a more powerful GPU, but I do not think it will get a 2019 update.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I would have jumped if

1) the WiFi and Bluetooth issues weren't present
2) The Mini came with a better GPU

It's a bummer. I really like the Mini, but cannot justify one especially with the WiFi/Bluetooth issues and having to buy a GPU. I was so gutted to experience WiFi dropouts and bluetooth issues at the 5th Avenue Apple store. I did like the new LG display too.

Oh well.

I'd love it if Apple fixed the WiFi and Bluetooth issues and put in a more powerful GPU, but I do not think it will get a 2019 update.

Not had any issues with mine. I use a BT keyboard, mouse and headphones.

 

[sublunar]

Do you think the Mac mini gets a small refresh in 2019?

The 9th generation CPUs don't really offer anything over the 8th generation desktop ones in the 2018 Mini. I've not been keeping up with the 10th generation ones currently out but there doesn't appear to be a desktop variant out at the moment.

I suppose that Apple could take an interest in any SKUs with good onboard graphics in the future but at first glance the 10th generation looks difficult to get on top of.

 

[kazmac]

Not had any issues with mine. I use a BT keyboard, mouse and headphones.

I am glad you have not had issues, but I cannot afford Wifi or bluetooth drop outs and having to buy an eGPU for it. I understand you've been okay without an eGPU, but these aren't risks I want to take.

 

[BenTrovato]

Just commenting because this thread is almost at 2 million views, incredible! I rocked the hell out of my 2012 i5 Mac Mini. I even ran it for a period of time with a 4K monitor (albeit at a frustrating 30hz). I just sold it to someone who I think will give it a good home and I picked up an Intel Nuc8 and boy am I a lot happier.

I won’t go on about how much better it is but I will say that I would have preferred a new Mini but at the prices they charge, it’s highway robbery. The price jumps $1000 to upgrade the base i3 and to get a 1tb ssd. It’s a bit much. I bought a 1tb m.2 ssd for $94. Come on. Apple charges $720 to “upgrade” from 128gb to 1tb. I don’t get it.

 

[Heat_Fan89]

Just commenting because this thread is almost at 2 million views, incredible! I rocked the hell out of my 2012 i5 Mac Mini. I even ran it for a period of time with a 4K monitor (albeit at a frustrating 30hz). I just sold it to someone who I think will give it a good home and I picked up an Intel Nuc8 and boy am I a lot happier.

I won’t go on about how much better it is but I will say that I would have preferred a new Mini but at the prices they charge, it’s highway robbery. The price jumps $1000 to upgrade the base i3 and to get a 1tb ssd. It’s a bit much. I bought a 1tb m.2 ssd for $94. Come on. Apple charges $720 to “upgrade” from 128gb to 1tb. I don’t get it.

I still have my 2012 Mini and I went with a Lenovo ThinkCentre Tiny. Similar specs to the 2018 i3 but with a 256GB M2 storage card for $398 plus tax. I'm still going back and forth about buying a 2018 base Mini because I do like the new OS releases each year. Currently the base Mini is $699 at Amazon and BH Photo and adding a TB3 SSD to the base Mini can be done a lot cheaper than upgrading the storage from Apple.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I am glad you have not had issues, but I cannot afford Wifi or bluetooth drop outs and having to buy an eGPU for it. I understand you've been okay without an eGPU, but these aren't risks I want to take.

I figured if I need an eGPU at some stage I can add one, but appreciate it’s not cheap.
But if you compare it to the new MacPro it’s a bargain!

I use Ethernet so can’t comment on the WiFi issues. But BT is good for me.