Twin Peaks (TV Series by David Lynch)

[yaxomoxay]

Ten episodes in and this is dragging, Cooper (mistaken for Dougey Jones, Bob’s Cooper doppelgänger) is still in LaLa Land, (a stumbling trance) with the TV series relying way too much on quirky characaters and behavior but not moving the story along adequately. I also find it suspect that Dougey Jones would go through such a drastic change in behavior and appearance, and his wife is not more concerned. Sure she takes him to the doctor, who declares hm healthy, but Cooper is basically out to lunch. Enough already.

@yaxomoxay, nothing personal, but my impression is you have to be really vested heavily in the Twin Peakes vibe to find this enjoyable. I feel like I'm obligated to finish this but, it difficult to keep going. Now just maybe the story will make a miraculous turn around and get to the point.

BTW, I was wondering if in Episode 10 you

Spoiler

Noticed the door glitch.

 

[Huntn]

BTW, I was wondering if in Episode 10 you

Spoiler

Noticed the door glitch.

Maybe... Tell me about it.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Maybe... Tell me about it.

Spoiler

Before meeting w/ Gordon and Albert in Gordon’s room, there is a brief scene of Tammy walking down the hall, I believe with some paperwork in her hand. If you look closely not only the scene is slowed down (a clue), but there’s also a glitch (a clue). Just one of the many glitches and clues, but this is somewhat symbolic because of the vision of Laura that Gordon had a few minutes earlier.

 

[Huntn]

Spoiler

Before meeting w/ Gordon and Albert in Gordon’s room, there is a brief scene of Tammy walking down the hall, I believe with some paperwork in her hand. If you look closely not only the scene is slowed down (a clue), but there’s also a glitch (a clue). Just one of the many glitches and clues, but this is somewhat symbolic because of the vision of Laura that Gordon had a few minutes earlier.

I do remember this, and the vision of Laura, but it just struck me as one of the many strange things that go on in this series.

 

[yaxomoxay]

I do remember this, and the vision of Laura, but it just struck me as one of the many strange things that go on in this series.

The more you watch it the more things you will find Certainly Lynch asks the viewers a lot (and quite a lot of patience). However, if you have seen Eraserhead you should not be surprised by this...

 

[Huntn]

Episode 16- Finally Cooper wakes up. In the 16th of 18 episodes, the narrative pivots and takes a huge step in the right direction, but is it too late? I'm still disappointed with the telling of this story, but two more to go and I'll give a final verdict.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Spoiler

Episode 16-

Spoiler

Finally Cooper wakes up. In the 16th of 18 episodes, the narrative pivots and takes a huge step in the right direction, but is it too late? I'm still disappointed with the telling of this story, but two more to go and I'll give a final verdict.

Spoiler

Put this under spoiler brackets please, it’s a big spoiler
Yes, the Dougie storyline might seem dragged, but if you think about it’s the only way to make Cooper’s awakening important and meaningful... and to say it as the casino lady, the only way to “realize how lucky we are to know someone like him”. Cooper’s awakening (hopefully you noticed the connection with the screaming girl at the end) is an historical event, it wouldn’t have the same power after a few episodes and it’s clearly a courageous way to defeat expectations. It’s delayed pleasure at its best... and remember that there’s a meaning for everything. Not that you have to like it of course many hated it, and at first I admit I was also concerned. As I mentioned, after further watch sessions and especially after the 18-hr marathon I can see how little we see Dougie and how everything fits together. Lynch really asks us a lot here...

As usual thanks for the update!!!

 

[Huntn]

Ok, finished series. I don't want to upset @yaxomoxay, but what a mess.

It could have been told in 1/3 the time, 6 episodes easy. Too much off the wall, weird stuff. I mean the last episode they drove for what felt like 10 minutes in a car without anything significant going on. And too much unexplained weird stuff that felt inconsequential, it was hard to keep my bearings, you can easily imo substitute one weird thing for another and get the same ending. For example:"

Spoiler

Diane gone, she's in the lodge, Cooper goes to the lodge, they meet, they leave the lodge, they are driving. They stop by power lines, "this is it" says Cooper, they drive, something changes, day turns to night, they stop in a motel room and make love. The next morning, no Diane. Cooper finds a note from some person to some other person. He drives to Odessa, Texas and locates Laura Palmer, who he saved in the past, but walking through the woods with her, she screams as she disappears. So after finding her (how?), she does not know the name Laura Palmer, thinks she is someone else, but he talks her to driving to Twin Peaks, but when they drive to her parent's house, there are no Palmers living there. She screams again, THE END. Was this a time paradox because he saved her? Maybe, Hell who knows. .

Next time I see David Lynch, I'll tell him, weird stuff does not substitute for coherent narrative. Showtime subscription cancelled.

 

[AutisticGuy]

Because it was to highly rated on IMDB, I thought I’d try out the original Twin Peaks series and I got through the first season. I’m not sure anybody could explain this show to me in such a way I’d understand. Is it trying to be serious, funny (a combination of both, I’m sure)? I’m actually going to rewatch it because I like the challenge of trying to understand something that too nuanced for to understand the first time, but I don’t hold up high hopes for understanding on a second go.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Ok, finished series. I don't want to upset @yaxomoxay, but what a mess.

Ahhaha this made me laugh out loud Will answer better tomorrow. Just know you’re now my mortal enemy


[doublepost=1520912019][/doublepost]

Because it was to highly rated on IMDB, I thought I’d try out the original Twin Peaks series and I got through the first season. I’m not sure anybody could explain this show to me in such a way I’d understand. Is it trying to be serious, funny (a combination of both, I’m sure)? I’m actually going to rewatch it because I like the challenge of trying to understand something that too nuanced for to understand the first time, but I don’t hold up high hopes for understanding on a second go.

You have to consider what television was in 1989. TP was virtually - if not literally - the first TV series with a continuous plot, supernatural events, and deeper characters. It was also a spoof on soap operas that were way too popular.
In addition, it was a commentary on some of the hypocrisies of the American society and drug use. Also, it brought rape, murder, incest, pain, and suffering on the small screen which was unheard of.
S1 and some episodes of S2 (episode 15 to 27 are avoidable) are true masterpieces. Of course now they might feel stale as many copied or were deeply inspired by them (see XFiles and Lost).
The movie and The Return are another thing all togheter.

 

[Huntn]

Because it was to highly rated on IMDB, I thought I’d try out the original Twin Peaks series and I got through the first season. I’m not sure anybody could explain this show to me in such a way I’d understand. Is it trying to be serious, funny (a combination of both, I’m sure)? I’m actually going to rewatch it because I like the challenge of trying to understand something that too nuanced for to understand the first time, but I don’t hold up high hopes for understanding on a second go.

In essence:

Spoiler

Bob is a dark, evil supernatural being that takes over a person, hides his presence, and does evil things in the shadows. This is what happened to Leland Palmer a victim controlled by Bob, who repeatedly raped his daughter.

I loved Seasons 1 and 2. Season 1 is the cleanest, easiest to understand sequence of events. This series relies somewhat on exaggerated, overacting as creative choice, and for many including myself, it worked, along with the mood music. I can also recommend Fire Walk With Me, the prequel. It clarifies, exactly what happened to Laura Palmer.

In The Return, I liked seeing many of the original actors back in their roles. It was kind of nostalgic. However, my critique is it was 2/3s too long, wastes too much time with the inconsequential, with some characters just making appearances for old times sake, with no real role in the story. Season 3 takes quirkiness and strange events to an extreme, introduces a time paradox, an alternate universe, and for lack of substance and clarity, sinks into story telling incoherence, requiring a guide to really understand what the writers are trying to communicate to the audience. Episode 18 was just the worst.

 

[yaxomoxay]

@Huntn here’s the longer answer, I needed coffee first.
Of course I am biased due to the fact that I just love TP’s world...
For the casual reader, big big big spoilers ahead.

Spoiler

I agree that TP:TR is not for everyone. It’s very different than the original, it has some flair of FWWM, but overall it’s a separate work.
Pacing is probably the biggest turn off for some people. I mentioned pacing to you months ago because I knew that the show might seem slow, especially in light of Dougie and the continuous silent parts, including the Odessa to TP drive scene. It is for this reason that I told you that the best way to check out this work is to do it in one viewing. I watched TP:TR this way: first on Sunday night with my wife when each episode was released. Then I re-watched the episode on Monday. On Saturday I let my kids watch the episode, so I re-watched it. After the series ended, I re-watched a few episodes at random. After about a month, together with a friend and my family we did the 18-hour marathon.
Why I mention this? Because that makes a huge difference. The 18-hour marathon radically changed my opinion on many things I disliked. For example, I found Audrey’s storyline too slow and dragged on forever (for some reason my eldest loved it since the first minute). Don’t ask me why, but during the marathon I started lauging like crazy; the scenes - especially the first one - became funny as heck. Other examples are Becky - a character I disliked with force - that now I find sad and lonely in a beautiful way. I am still not convinced by Dr. Jacoby’s etc. However the most important thing, and I asked everyone in the room at the end of the 18 hours and they all agreed, is that it felt... rushed. I am not joking, and reading online this seems the common conclusion. It felt like there was no time whatsoever to breathe, and it felt like everything was happening so fast... Dougie included.
Symbolism is of course one of the most studied traits of this work. At first TP:TR might seem inconsistent, and trust me we’re still trying to understand many parts. However let me ask you:
- Have you noticed who’s face is on the pointed nose guy’s face when Cooper and the One Armed Man walk up the stairs of the Convenience Store?
- Have you noticed the Double R in the last episode, and what changed about it?
- Have you noticed the Double R’s clientele sudden change and hidden double music track when we saw it from the inside?
- Have you followed Cooper’s pin?
- Have you noticed that the repeat scenes (such as Leland telling Cooper “Find Laura”) are NOT repeat scenes?
- Have you noticed that the tree (formerly known as the little man ) says the same thing that Audrey says?
- Have you noticed what links the screaming Asian girl to three of the pivotal scenes, including the very last one?
- Have you noticed that we see Carrie PAGE in a scene virtually identical to the one in which Cooper finds the missing page of Laura’s Diary in S2? (With swap of home owners included?)
- Have you found out what the noise from the grammophone in the first scene (Giant: “Listen to the sounds), which is also heard right before Laura disappears?
And so on. The truth is that this work is a puzzle, and the more you check it the more it makes sense. At this point it’s pretty evident that Richard and Carrie’s universe are a big trap set up for Judy by the Fireman.
The strength of this show is also its weakness. It’s full of details. Right now there’s a theory that analyzes the possibility that Mr.C is split in two as there are few clues when he meets Jeffreys.
Being LYNCH’d is another trait of the movie. We all know Lynch, wether we like him as a director or not. This show had so many references to his past works that it’s difficult to keep up. Just the connections with Eraserheads are many:

Or even Mullholland Dr (in which we see Laura and Ronette...) with the Club Silencio and even Del Rey’s song (which incidentally means to wake up from a “dream”).

Obviously there is much more to say about this show. It’s obviously controversial, and it’s obviously well-thought of. That doesn’t mean that one should like the end results by any means.
[doublepost=1520949052][/doublepost]

In essence:

Spoiler

Bob is a dark, evil supernatural being that takes over a person, hides his presence, and does evil things in the shadows. This is what happened to Leland Palmer a victim controlled by Bob, who repeatedly raped his daughter.

I loved Seasons 1 and 2. Season 1 is the cleanest, easiest to understand sequence of events. This series relies somewhat on exaggerated, overacting as creative choice, and for many including myself, it worked, along with the mood music. I can also recommend Fire Walk With Me, the prequel. It clarifies, exactly what happened to Laura Palmer.

In The Return, I liked seeing many of the original actors back in their roles. It was kind of nostalgic. However, my critique is it was 2/3s too long, wastes too much time with the inconsequential, with some characters just making appearances for old times sake, with no real role in the story. Season 3 takes quirkiness and strange events to an extreme, introduces a time paradox and for lack of substance and clarity, sinks into story telling incoherence, requiring a guide to really understand what the writers are trying to communicate to the audience. Episode 18 was just the worst.

Episode 18 was a

Spoiler

different universe

. Remember that TP was always supposed to be an infinite story within the story of another story and so on. (Until CBS decided to ruin the series by revealing who killed Laura Palmer, bringing it to its fall). The more I watch E18 the more I like it - and the more I notice things (see the

Spoiler

dead guy in the living room’s belly etc

)

 

[Huntn]

@Huntn here’s the longer answer, I needed coffee first.
Of course I am biased due to the fact that I just love TP’s world...
For the casual reader, big big big spoilers ahead.

Spoiler

I agree that TP:TR is not for everyone. It’s very different than the original, it has some flair of FWWM, but overall it’s a separate work.
Pacing is probably the biggest turn off for some people. I mentioned pacing to you months ago because I knew that the show might seem slow, especially in light of Dougie and the continuous silent parts, including the Odessa to TP drive scene. It is for this reason that I told you that the best way to check out this work is to do it in one viewing. I watched TP:TR this way: first on Sunday night with my wife when each episode was released. Then I re-watched the episode on Monday. On Saturday I let my kids watch the episode, so I re-watched it. After the series ended, I re-watched a few episodes at random. After about a month, together with a friend and my family we did the 18-hour marathon.
Why I mention this? Because that makes a huge difference. The 18-hour marathon radically changed my opinion on many things I disliked. For example, I found Audrey’s storyline too slow and dragged on forever (for some reason my eldest loved it since the first minute). Don’t ask me why, but during the marathon I started lauging like crazy; the scenes - especially the first one - became funny as heck. Other examples are Becky - a character I disliked with force - that now I find sad and lonely in a beautiful way. I am still not convinced by Dr. Jacoby’s etc. However the most important thing, and I asked everyone in the room at the end of the 18 hours and they all agreed, is that it felt... rushed. I am not joking, and reading online this seems the common conclusion. It felt like there was no time whatsoever to breathe, and it felt like everything was happening so fast... Dougie included.
Symbolism is of course one of the most studied traits of this work. At first TP:TR might seem inconsistent, and trust me we’re still trying to understand many parts. However let me ask you:
- Have you noticed who’s face is on the pointed nose guy’s face when Cooper and the One Armed Man walk up the stairs of the Convenience Store?
- Have you noticed the Double R in the last episode, and what changed about it?
- Have you noticed the Double R’s clientele sudden change and hidden double music track when we saw it from the inside?
- Have you followed Cooper’s pin?
- Have you noticed that the repeat scenes (such as Leland telling Cooper “Find Laura”) are NOT repeat scenes?
- Have you noticed that the tree (formerly known as the little man ) says the same thing that Audrey says?
- Have you noticed what links the screaming Asian girl to three of the pivotal scenes, including the very last one?
- Have you noticed that we see Carrie PAGE in a scene virtually identical to the one in which Cooper finds the missing page of Laura’s Diary in S2? (With swap of home owners included?)
- Have you found out what the noise from the grammophone in the first scene (Giant: “Listen to the sounds), which is also heard right before Laura disappears?
And so on. The truth is that this work is a puzzle, and the more you check it the more it makes sense. At this point it’s pretty evident that Richard and Carrie’s universe are a big trap set up for Judy by the Fireman.
The strength of this show is also its weakness. It’s full of details. Right now there’s a theory that analyzes the possibility that Mr.C is split in two as there are few clues when he meets Jeffreys.
Being LYNCH’d is another trait of the movie. We all know Lynch, wether we like him as a director or not. This show had so many references to his past works that it’s difficult to keep up. Just the connections with Eraserheads are many:

Or even Mullholland Dr (in which we see Laura and Ronette...) with the Club Silencio and even Del Rey’s song (which incidentally means to wake up from a “dream”).

Obviously there is much more to say about this show. It’s obviously controversial, and it’s obviously well-thought of. That doesn’t mean that one should like the end results by any means.
[doublepost=1520949052][/doublepost]

Episode 18 was a

Spoiler

different universe

. Remember that TP was always supposed to be an infinite story within the story of another story and so on. (Until CBS decided to ruin the series by revealing who killed Laura Palmer, bringing it to its fall). The more I watch E18 the more I like it - and the more I notice things (see the

Spoiler

dead guy in the living room’s belly etc

)

I accept that you really like this show. My critiques stand as valid observations. Sure, throw in a parallel universe too why not!

 

[yaxomoxay]

I accept that you really like this show. My critiques stand as valid observations. Sure, throw in a parallel universe too why not!

Oh, all of your observations and opinions are valid! I didn’t mean to diminish their value in any way whatsoever (I actually publicly defended those who disliked the show on the TP’s forums) or to imply that you’re “wrong” (since it’s art I don’t think there’s right or wrong).

 

[Huntn]

Oh, all of your observations and opinions are valid! I didn’t mean to diminish their value in any way whatsoever (I actually publicly defended those who disliked the show on the TP’s forums) or to imply that you’re “wrong” (since it’s art I don’t think there’s right or wrong).

I think it boils down to personal limits, what the individual finds enjoyable. My primary critique is too much filler to reach 18 episodes. Yes, things were happening in each episode, but often the time was not spent most effectively, as in get to the point!

Spoiler

Now I was happy that Ed and Norma found happiness.

 

[yaxomoxay]

I think it boils down to personal limits, what the individual finds enjoyable. My primary critique is too much filler to reach 18 episodes. Yes, things were happening in each episode, but often the time was not spent most effectively, as in get to the point!

Spoiler

Now I was happy that Ed and Norma found happiness.

(Totally agreed on the part within the spoiler tags... however that scene LYNCH’d us again given what happens after that).

At any rate, I agree that it depends on personal limits. Some people would watch a movie by a given director even if it’s just 90 minutes of black, while other need superheroes movies, and so on. It’s normal, and it’s actually good. Everyone is different and that’s the beauty of art.

However, let me point out that the “fillers” are not really fillers. They do fill a purpose which became clear to me in the honking woman scene.

Spoiler

Actually it became clear to me in two phases. First when we see dreamy Becky in the car with Simon, then when we see the kid shooter dressed up as his dad and giving “the look” to Bobby. The woman and the sick girl at the end of the long scene were just the cherry on top of the (cherry) cake/pie.

Most of those scenes serve a very important cultural and social commentary, for that reason I assume that they were mostly written by Frost rather than Lynch (S1 was also a social commentary). They also serve as a very harsh critique of nostalgia (there is no coming back, and no emulation or future edition of TP can bring back the original charming town exactly as no high school reunion can’t bring back the years of high school, but might actually do the opposite and ruin the magic of the “good ‘ol times”).
I believe - and again, it’s art so that’s how I read it; that doesn’t mean that you’re wrong if you don’t read the same message - that what Frost and Lynch (not random order) did something very corageous and put it on our screens without us even realizing it.
You can point to each “filler” scene (the crazy Polish accountant that shoots people only because they park in the driveway, the honking woman, the comment that “people are under a lot of stress” (that was memorable), the “Congressman Dilemma”, etc and see what the critique is. Even Jacoby spells it out, but being the weirdo that he is he’s not really credible.
I suggest that you watch this brief video/podcast. Despite the title, it makes pretty good points on what is happening during those fillers.

I am sure that as a member and contributor in PRSI you will appreciate it. Let me know what you think of it I am always happy to talk Twin Peaks.

 

[Huntn]

(Totally agreed on the part within the spoiler tags... however that scene LYNCH’d us again given what happens after that).

At any rate, I agree that it depends on personal limits. Some people would watch a movie by a given director even if it’s just 90 minutes of black, while other need superheroes movies, and so on. It’s normal, and it’s actually good. Everyone is different and that’s the beauty of art.

However, let me point out that the “fillers” are not really fillers. They do fill a purpose which became clear to me in the honking woman scene.

Spoiler

Actually it became clear to me in two phases. First when we see dreamy Becky in the car with Simon, then when we see the kid shooter dressed up as his dad and giving “the look” to Bobby. The woman and the sick girl at the end of the long scene were just the cherry on top of the (cherry) cake/pie.

Most of those scenes serve a very important cultural and social commentary, for that reason I assume that they were mostly written by Frost rather than Lynch (S1 was also a social commentary). They also serve as a very harsh critique of nostalgia (there is no coming back, and no emulation or future edition of TP can bring back the original charming town exactly as no high school reunion can’t bring back the years of high school, but might actually do the opposite and ruin the magic of the “good ‘ol times”).
I believe - and again, it’s art so that’s how I read it; that doesn’t mean that you’re wrong if you don’t read the same message - that what Frost and Lynch (not random order) did something very corageous and put it on our screens without us even realizing it.
You can point to each “filler” scene (the crazy Polish accountant that shoots people only because they park in the driveway, the honking woman, the comment that “people are under a lot of stress” (that was memorable), the “Congressman Dilemma”, etc and see what the critique is. Even Jacoby spells it out, but being the weirdo that he is he’s not really credible.
I suggest that you watch this brief video/podcast. Despite the title, it makes pretty good points on what is happening during those fillers.

I am sure that as a member and contributor in PRSI you will appreciate it. Let me know what you think of it I am always happy to talk Twin Peaks.

I’ll watch this.

 

[Mefisto]

Holy balls. Just finished The Return a couple of hours ago and I'm somewhat in a trance. This was exactly, at the same time not at all, and yet more than what I dared to expect.

I'm still, and will be for a while, collecting my thought on the whole thing, but wanted to say that I've really enjoyed reading the thoughts and interpretations of others posted in this thread. Me personally, I'm at the same time frothing at the mouth for a fourth season, but at the same time I think this wrapped things up quite nicely. In the Lynchian sense of the word, that is.

I'm thinking the only sensible thing to do now is to fire up the BD of FWWM, the original series and watch The Return again. Well maybe not right away, but in a very near future.

 

[Huntn]

(Totally agreed on the part within the spoiler tags... however that scene LYNCH’d us again given what happens after that).

At any rate, I agree that it depends on personal limits. Some people would watch a movie by a given director even if it’s just 90 minutes of black, while other need superheroes movies, and so on. It’s normal, and it’s actually good. Everyone is different and that’s the beauty of art.

However, let me point out that the “fillers” are not really fillers. They do fill a purpose which became clear to me in the honking woman scene.

Spoiler

Actually it became clear to me in two phases. First when we see dreamy Becky in the car with Simon, then when we see the kid shooter dressed up as his dad and giving “the look” to Bobby. The woman and the sick girl at the end of the long scene were just the cherry on top of the (cherry) cake/pie.

Most of those scenes serve a very important cultural and social commentary, for that reason I assume that they were mostly written by Frost rather than Lynch (S1 was also a social commentary). They also serve as a very harsh critique of nostalgia (there is no coming back, and no emulation or future edition of TP can bring back the original charming town exactly as no high school reunion can’t bring back the years of high school, but might actually do the opposite and ruin the magic of the “good ‘ol times”).
I believe - and again, it’s art so that’s how I read it; that doesn’t mean that you’re wrong if you don’t read the same message - that what Frost and Lynch (not random order) did something very corageous and put it on our screens without us even realizing it.
You can point to each “filler” scene (the crazy Polish accountant that shoots people only because they park in the driveway, the honking woman, the comment that “people are under a lot of stress” (that was memorable), the “Congressman Dilemma”, etc and see what the critique is. Even Jacoby spells it out, but being the weirdo that he is he’s not really credible.
I suggest that you watch this brief video/podcast. Despite the title, it makes pretty good points on what is happening during those fillers.

I am sure that as a member and contributor in PRSI you will appreciate it. Let me know what you think of it I am always happy to talk Twin Peaks.

Regarding the video podcast, outstanding dissection of the show. I agree with the social commentary, the nostalgia for the past, highlighting deteriorating, declining middle class and social conditions, everything except for calling it profound, because while I can appreciate profound social commentary, this is not the primary reason I’m watching. I still demand a good coherent story and I want a payoff which was not forthcoming.

Draping social commentary on a schizoid narrative does not make for a profound movie going experience, does not substitute for a coherent story that includes the intrigue, the supernatural, and the styilized atmosphere absent, that made the original series special.

From the podcast video, with spoilers:
I agree with all, except where I struck through.

An elaborate joke, with a very long setup, that you are waiting for the punchline, but then the punchline is an anti-climatic pun, something goofy, but not funny, not worth the payoff. That in itself is the joke (played on the viewer). You are getting fed all of this information in anticipation of something that never comes. And I think right there is the reason you can appreciate The Return.

Maybe...

In the original TP, Dale Cooper goes through all of this to become what he has been fighting. eighteen hours, nothing gets answered, the real Dale Cooper barely shows up, then Dale and (he calls her Laura) Diane time travel...and that’s it. An elaborate joke and no punchline, a work of art, absurdity, something to admire in itself.

Something to admire, all boils down to the eye of the beholder.

Of note they called it time travel, I called it a time travel paradox, while you described it as a parallel universe. It seems to be best described as whatever, a mishmash of possibilities as in why would an adult Laura be living in Odessa Texas and not know she was Laura Palmer? Many possibilities, after Coop came out of the Lodge in a past time, and intervened to save Laura, a time paradox existed. You can either go with the branching parallel reality, but that would not explain why Laura Palmer had forgotten her past. But to Lynch and crew, it really makes no difference. The viewer is in the position of accepting what your eyes are seeing and not questioning or stomping away in disgust.

More Spoilers:
Another aspect I’ll mention, when Bob possessed Leland Palmer, it seemed like he possessed him, he was still there in his body as evidenced by his dying words. When he died then we saw the innocent Leland Palmer in the Lodge. Yet for Coop, a doppelgänger was created, with a separate Coop in the Lodge. Another thing I did not like, was that they did a horrible job distinguishing between the Black and White Lodge. It all looked interchangeable although one side was supposed to represent good, and another represented evil. I’ll admit, that maybe they were trying to show that good and evil are all part of the human psyche, but good and bad as concepts are different enough that I’d expect a different motif.

 

[AutisticGuy]

In essence:

Spoiler

Bob is a dark, evil supernatural being that takes over a person, hides his presence, and does evil things in the shadows. This is what happened to Leland Palmer a victim controlled by Bob, who repeatedly raped his daughter.

I loved Seasons 1 and 2. Season 1 is the cleanest, easiest to understand sequence of events. This series relies somewhat on exaggerated, overacting as creative choice, and for many including myself, it worked, along with the mood music. I can also recommend Fire Walk With Me, the prequel. It clarifies, exactly what happened to Laura Palmer.

In The Return, I liked seeing many of the original actors back in their roles. It was kind of nostalgic. However, my critique is it was 2/3s too long, wastes too much time with the inconsequential, with some characters just making appearances for old times sake, with no real role in the story. Season 3 takes quirkiness and strange events to an extreme, introduces a time paradox, an alternate universe, and for lack of substance and clarity, sinks into story telling incoherence, requiring a guide to really understand what the writers are trying to communicate to the audience. Episode 18 was just the worst.

So, I certainly understood the general story line. It’s the way the people behave with each other and in general.

Minor Spoiler Alert:

So in the first episode, we have the boyfriend and girlfriend driving to the girlfriend’s dad’s house to make out. Obviously the dad is home, and the boyfriend just yells out “Wisconsin” or wherever the heck the dad was supposed to be at. So I get the boyfriend is basically saying that the girlfriend is wrong and the dad is home and all that jazz. But it’s really bizarre to just say that one word and then turn the car around. I’d expect more dialogue. It isn’t the underlying plot or subplots I don’t understand, it’s the behavior.

As another example, there’s this guy Ed who owns that gas station and he’s obviously married. Yet he interacts with one of the teen girls (forget her name) on a very personal level, like he’s giving fatherly advice. I don’t understand the relationship between the two of them. I know they aren’t in a dating relationship (that’d be wrong, obviously), but I don’t understand what their relationship *is*. I’d guess he might have known her all of her life, but still, I wouldn’t expect them to be discussing such personal things.

I’m not looking for explanations or anything, just giving examples on how the acting and writing just seem too nuanced for me to understand. I’m just not “in the the joke” so to speak.

 

[Mefisto]

I’m not looking for explanations or anything, just giving examples on how the acting and writing just seem too nuanced for me to understand. I’m just not “in the the joke” so to speak.

The great thing is that none of us (except for David Lynch) are "in on the joke", as far as Lynch is concerned. And once you realize that, it all just get's much better.

At the same time I do get that it's not for everyone, and, at times, can seem downright stupid. I'm not going to address the points you made in your post because you said you're not looking for explanations, but if you choose to revisit Lynch's work, try to remember that his way of storytelling isn't exactly conventional. Actually pretty far from it.

 

[yaxomoxay]

So, I certainly understood the general story line. It’s the way the people behave with each other and in general.

Minor Spoiler Alert:

So in the first episode, we have the boyfriend and girlfriend driving to the girlfriend’s dad’s house to make out. Obviously the dad is home, and the boyfriend just yells out “Wisconsin” or wherever the heck the dad was supposed to be at. So I get the boyfriend is basically saying that the girlfriend is wrong and the dad is home and all that jazz. But it’s really bizarre to just say that one word and then turn the car around. I’d expect more dialogue. It isn’t the underlying plot or subplots I don’t understand, it’s the behavior.

Quick answer on this.
I think I know which scene you’re referring to. The guy home is not her dad. He’s the girlfriend’s husband. She (Shelly) is cheating on him (Leo) with Bobby (kid driving the car). Bobby (who was also Laura’s boyfriend and was cheating on her) and Shelly thought that Leo was out of town since he’s a trucker and called Shelly the night before (I think from Wisconsin). You will soon find out why Bobby and Shelly reacted that way.
[doublepost=1521420148][/doublepost]

As another example, there’s this guy Ed who owns that gas station and he’s obviously married. Yet he interacts with one of the teen girls (forget her name) on a very personal level, like he’s giving fatherly advice. I don’t understand the relationship between the two of them.

Ed is James’s (the biker’s) uncle. He knows about James and Laura and he’s a very good friend of Donna (the girl you are taking about) who was Laura’s best friend.
While you can’t really sum up everything at this point, you already noticed an important trait of Lynch’s filmmaking. He is not going to tell you what is happening. He’s not going to spoon feed you, and he’s not going to have the characters spell out what is going on. He’s going to use the movie as a moving painting, you have to be very attentive on what is happening on screen, especially on a visual standpoint. You will have to do the work and connect the dots. Don’t expect to see ever a clear resolution of the plot points without having to spend time and brain power on them. The only time he did that, he was forced by CBS and caused the downfall of Twin Peaks. Furthermore, David Lynch will not even do a DVD/Blu-ray commentary and he won’t tell you anything even after the movie aired (except in Mulholland Drive, for which he gave ten clues on what should be watched carefully).
In addition, all of this is mixed with quirky characters and events that at times touch the surreal.
Some people love it, some people hate it. Just know when you watch two hours of a Lynch move you are actually watching something that has way more hours worth of value in it.

 

[AutisticGuy]

Quick answer on this.
I think I know which scene you’re referring to. The guy home is not her dad. He’s the girlfriend’s husband. She (Shelly) is cheating on him (Leo) with Bobby (kid driving the car). Bobby (who was also Laura’s boyfriend and was cheating on her) and Shelly thought that Leo was out of town since he’s a trucker and called Shelly the night before (I think from Wisconsin). You will soon find out why Bobby and Shelly reacted that way.
[doublepost=1521420148][/doublepost]

Ed is James’s (the biker’s) uncle. He knows about James and Laura and he’s a very good friend of Donna (the girl you are taking about) who was Laura’s best friend.
While you can’t really sum up everything at this point, you already noticed an important trait of Lynch’s filmmaking. He is not going to tell you what is happening. He’s not going to spoon feed you, and he’s not going to have the characters spell out what is going on. He’s going to use the movie as a moving painting, you have to be very attentive on what is happening on screen, especially on a visual standpoint. You will have to do the work and connect the dots. Don’t expect to see ever a clear resolution of the plot points without having to spend time and brain power on them. The only time he did that, he was forced by CBS and caused the downfall of Twin Peaks. Furthermore, David Lynch will not even do a DVD/Blu-ray commentary and he won’t tell you anything even after the movie aired (except in Mulholland Drive, for which he gave ten clues on what should be watched carefully).
In addition, all of this is mixed with quirky characters and events that at times touch the surreal.
Some people love it, some people hate it. Just know when you watch two hours of a Lynch move you are actually watching something that has way more hours worth of value in it.

Just to save myself a little "face", I misremembered about the cheating on the boyfriend because I typed that message before I got to the part where the boyfriend is presented and being all abusive to Shelly.

That said, I'm going to go back to where Ed is introduced because I want to know HOW you figured all of that out. Seriously, you can't "read between" the lines like that? It must be somehow mentioned or inferred in the dialogue? Anyway, that's not the point. This is a good example of what I'm talking about....missing the nuances.

So who is "Dianne" supposed to be? The one who agent Cooper is always talking to via tape recorder? I'd assume she's like his assistant or something? Even if I'm right, I don't understand the point of having him have dialogue with a tape recorder for the sake of the audience. It's weird.....

 

[Mefisto]

So who is "Dianne" supposed to be? The one who agent Cooper is always talking to via tape recorder? I'd assume she's like his assistant or something? Even if I'm right, I don't understand the point of having him have dialogue with a tape recorder for the sake of the audience. It's weird.....

EDIT: The post below this one gives a better explanation.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Just to save myself a little "face", I misremembered about the cheating on the boyfriend because I typed that message before I got to the part where the boyfriend is presented and being all abusive to Shelly.

That said, I'm going to go back to where Ed is introduced because I want to know HOW you figured all of that out. Seriously, you can't "read between" the lines like that? It must be somehow mentioned or inferred in the dialogue? Anyway, that's not the point. This is a good example of what I'm talking about....missing the nuances.

So who is "Dianne" supposed to be? The one who agent Cooper is always talking to via tape recorder? I'd assume she's like his assistant or something? Even if I'm right, I don't understand the point of having him have dialogue with a tape recorder for the sake of the audience. It's weird.....

Honestly I don’t remember how I figured out about Ed. I watched the series in 1989! As with many TV series - especially mysteries - I don’t believe you are supposed to figure out everything as soon as it appears on screen. I mean even “lighter” series like the Gilmore Girls or This is Us keep secrets from the audience for several episodes if not entire seasons. On top of that, a Lynch work is even more multi layered...

As for Diane... I will not tell you much because long-term spoilers are involved. I am not sure if you were born before the age of the internet so yeah it might be difficult to understand if you’re pretty young. Among other things, Diane serves as a particular trait of Agent Cooper. It’s something that is supposed to make Cooper a little “special” and “weird”, different than anybody else. Let’s say that for now it just makes the character as quirky as possible. Also, it allows the viewer to know what Cooper is thinking without having him talk loud to nobody like many movies and series do. However let me point out that talking to a tape recorder - or the iPhone recorder - is not strange or unique. Many busy individuals that are always on the move take notes that way, and that was true even more when mobile communication and/or digital note taking was not widespread. White House Chief of staff Haldeman used to take notes and to dictate his diary using tapes. Kevin J Anderson, a very prolific writer which is still very active, writes entire books by dictating the book’s draft on a tape recorder, usually while hiking.


[doublepost=1521454568][/doublepost]

Spoiler

She's indeed his assistant / secretary. And having him talk to her via a tape recorder? Just another story telling technique the show uses.

Pretty big spoiler

Spoiler

I had to wait 25+ years to be sure of it